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| RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more smoke http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=91474 |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more smoke |
First thing happened RPM's dropped from about 950 to 800, but were steady. Took it to mechanics couldn't undo the crank pulley nut, took it to dealer. They took belt out , rang me and said I have to pay 150% on top of quoted price as the water pump is located behind. Forwarded them coloradowheel thread and they did it as quoted. Changed Belts, Water pump, pulleys, tensioner, flushed coolant. Started getting more black smoke 1st, 2nd, 3rd accelerating. No smoke on motorway. Nothing out ordinary during high acceleration at speed. Doesn't start from first pop as used to. RPM's started jumping between 720-870 when heats up, cold steady. Higher MPG's. No codes. Cleaned MAF, MAP, new air filter. Checked with a scanner, fuel rail pressure jumps between 5720 -6370 psi. Contacted one guy he said it's the High Pressure Injector Pump Regulator Valve. Now, how do I check it and how do I get to it without a ramp? Any other precautions, do I need to block fuel line? Any pics? Much appreciated. |
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| Author: | TKB4 [ Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
From what u said you had the normal timing belt service done. How many miles are on the jeep and what year is it? Black smoke is most often excess fuel in proportion to air available for combustion resulting from not developing enough boost and the most common cause of this is a loose or cracked boost hose. Do you have the original boost hoses or have they been replaced with the Silicone type like Samcos? Check closely for loose clamps or a crack in the boost hoses they often have excessive oily residue sometimes you can hear a hissing sound from a larger crack. Does the jeep have a Check engine light on and if it does were the codes read and what were they. It shouldn't require ramps to change the fuel regulator sensor but I wonder why someone thinks its the problem since it sounds like relatively excess fuel not a lack of fuel and once there is adequate pressure the ECM and injectors control the amount of fuel delivery to combustion chamber. If those pressures are psi they appear to be low. There are several here that are much more familiar with the fuel system than I am and I am sure they will chime in to help further. Start with inspecting the boost hoses classic symptom black smoke on acceleration. |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
It's KJ 2007 2.8 crd , hoses seem fine, 140.000, original hoses, no check engine light, capped EGR at around 60.000. I am assuming he thinks it's because of the jumping pressure. Just don't know how to get to it to inspect, tried youtube, but no videos. Thanks in advance. |
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| Author: | TURBO-DIESEL-FREAK [ Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Maxy Waxy wrote: It's KJ 2007 2.8 crd , hoses seem fine, 140.000, original hoses, no check engine light, capped EGR at around 60.000. I am assuming he thinks it's because of the jumping pressure. Just don't know how to get to it to inspect, tried youtube, but no videos. Thanks in advance. Are you in the North American market, or are you offshore? |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Tue Jun 09, 2020 8:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
It's a european model. I'm not in US. |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
If you suspect a fuel problem, first thing to do is replace the fuel filter. Black smoke is typically from not enough air getting into the engine. If your scan tool can read fuel rail pressure it can probably also read manifold pressure. So, watch the manifold pressure reading while driving and report what you see. Also inspect all the intake and turbo hoses. Honestly, given all the symptoms, I suspect badly worn or damaged rocker arms. But a lot of other things can be checked before tearing into the engine. I don't think its anything related to the fuel injection pump or fuel control solenoids. Fuel rail pressure will naturally go up and down according to RPM. If RPM is changing, so will fuel pressure. |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Done fuel filter recently and have been doing it every 10 for the last 5 years, same with oil, air filter changed more frequently. Do you think rocker arms could be an issue at 140,000 km ? I'm not a diesel mechanic, but I think those should last longer, no? Inspected hoses, seemed fine, tiny bit of oil, but after 140,000 it's ok, I'm guessing. MAP idling 14.6 psi and then changes to 13.2 psi as warms up a bit. MAF 0.04 LB/s while idling. Will try recording figures while driving. Have added a bottle of Injector Cleaner, see how it'll go. |
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| Author: | TURBO-DIESEL-FREAK [ Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Maxy Waxy wrote: It's a european model. I'm not in US. Does your CRD have a fuel lift pump in the tank? |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
I believe so, I think it's standard for these models. |
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| Author: | rankom [ Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Maxy Waxy wrote: I believe so, I think it's standard for these models. No you don't have intank fuel pump TDF is correct if you need to look into a possibility of air in the fuel system. also you need to go back and double check your timing injectors etc,, and at the end it may be worn out rockers (someone else suggested earlier). |
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| Author: | flash7210 [ Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Quote: Do you think rocker arms could be an issue at 140,000 km ? I wish I could confidently say no. I don't know in what order symptoms started occurring but its possible that a botched timing belt job could have damaged the rocker arms. Or maybe its just abnormal wear and tear. Both are possibilities. Again, keep checking for other things. Maybe its a bad injector? But this does not seem like a fuel system problem. |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Thanks, How could rocker arms get damaged during the belt change procedure? It was a dealer, I believe they had all required tools to lock the mechanism. I've added an Injector Cleaner and seems that it helps, engine is more responsive as well as a bit more noisy, less smoke, MPG's are going down. Will listen for ticking sounds ( worn rocker arms ). Regards. |
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| Author: | PZKW108 [ Thu Jun 11, 2020 8:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Maxy Waxy wrote: Thanks, How could rocker arms get damaged during the belt change procedure? It was a dealer, I believe they had all required tools to lock the mechanism. I've added an Injector Cleaner and seems that it helps, engine is more responsive as well as a bit more noisy, less smoke, MPG's are going down. Will listen for ticking sounds ( worn rocker arms ). Regards. The rockers will usually get bad when the roller stop turning...….. Is this engine single overhead cam ? |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Fri Jun 12, 2020 8:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
It is DOHC, Actually injector cleaner only dropped MPG's and helping fuel to burn, because of that engine produces a bit less smoke. RPM's still jump while idling. Tried to hold accelerator pedal steady on 1000, 1500 and 2000 rpm's, engine is steady but the Fuel Rail Pressure rises with acceleration and jumps in a range of 300 psi. Regards. |
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| Author: | casm [ Fri Jun 12, 2020 8:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Just out of curiosity: can you drain the water out of the fuel filter and see if there's any change after that? |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Sun Jun 14, 2020 4:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
Thanks for the clue. The filter is newish and I never had to do that before, I'll try and see. The funny thing is it doesn't do it every time. When you drive for a bit and stop ( idle ) rpm's steady, after 30 - 60 sec start jumping. It smokes more than usual only after RPM's jump. RPM's only noticeable jumping while idling, otherwise you don't feel it. If you drive and stop ( stop for very short time before RPM's start jumping ) it doesn't smoke as much. Something builds up. Another thing comes on and off is when you drive at around 1500 RPM steady it kind of jerking sometimes, not much, but i can fill it. As if it's starving on fuel or not getting enough air. |
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| Author: | rankom [ Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
I would test injectors, and by the way im the only one on this forum to experience injector #! sticking so bad that it almost burned a hole through the piston so I suggest testing them, the rest of the guys here didn't get too much luck with injectors sticking. but I did have that experience. |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
How should I test them? Pull out and inspect? Cheers. |
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| Author: | Maxy Waxy [ Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
I think I'm going to clean all injectors first and see what they look like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XK7U9gotGhE |
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| Author: | rankom [ Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: RPM jumping up and down, higher fuel consumption, more s |
don't take them apart, just send them to Bosch fuel injection shop. they will test it for you. |
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