LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Towing limits for manual transmission KK

I noticed on the specifications for the KK that the towing limits for the manual transmission is 3500 lbs and for the automatic transmission it is 5000 lbs. These limits are applicable with the factory towing package installed. Why is the manual transmission limit lower? Is it just weaker?

The KK comes in stick?

I came across this in my continuing research:

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/080227.htm

I don't own a KK yet but I am looking at them. I am interested in the 6 speed manual for gas mileage. I believe that the manual is geared to 321 compaired to 370 for the auto which puts more low end torque on the pull.

Where did you guys find the different tow specs? My six speed came with the factory class 3 hitch which is capable of withstanding 5000lbs but I didn't know the jeep it self was not able. Even though the jeep auto is rated at 5000 pounds I dont think I would do it. Even my dodge ram with the 5.9l v8 is not very fun to drive with 5000lbs hooked up to the back. Has anyone here tried towing that weight with there kk?

There has to be a big difference in gas mileage with 6 speed manual and 321 gearing compaired to the auto which is only a 4 speed with 373 gears. Anyone ever drive both and notice a big diffenece off the line in torque and pull? Not a lot of options with the Liberty your stuck with what they give you and no other choices. A 4 speed auto not five. 321 gears for manual trannies and no options for locking differential. Only one engine choice. I loved the old Jeep inline 6 engine it was one of their best motors they ever made. It only had 190 HP and 230 Torque and that pulled quite well. My thinking is that the clutch and pressure plate along with 321 gearing dropped the tow rate down to 3500, which is still a lot of weight. Toung weight is the same.

Author:	DragonFly [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:15 pm ]
Post subject:	Towing limits for manual transmission KK
I noticed on the specifications for the KK that the towing limits for the manual transmission is 3500 lbs and for the automatic transmission it is 5000 lbs. These limits are applicable with the factory towing package installed. Why is the manual transmission limit lower? Is it just weaker?

Author:	Diggerfreek [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:
if any thing, it is stronger... but i think it has to do with trans fluid temp... the autos have a cooler... the fluid in the manual trans is only like a 5w-30

Author:	tjkj2002 [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Towing limits for manual transmission KK
DragonFly wrote: I noticed on the specifications for the KK that the towing limits for the manual transmission is 3500 lbs and for the automatic transmission it is 5000 lbs. These limits are applicable with the factory towing package installed. Why is the manual transmission limit lower? Is it just weaker? The weaker clutch and manual tranny compared to the auto tranny.Not that manuals are weaker in general but to be able to tow those heavy loads you'll need a real beefy manual tranny with is real big and heavy.The manual tranny in the KK is just a little guy and is limited due to it's strength and small clutch.You can tow that 5000lbs with your stick but plan on changing the clutch after each tow at that weight.

Author:	isutherl [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 3:01 am ]
Post subject:
The KK comes in stick?

Author:	KJ4ME [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:40 pm ]
Post subject:
they are actually alot easier to find in stick than the kj was.

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Author:	DragonFly [ Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:46 pm ]
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Given the extra load towing puts on the manual transmission, should one do extra maintenance on it? Should a different oil be used? Changed more frequently? I'm planning on towing a pop-up camper which will be 2000 lbs when fully loaded, so it's within limits, but I'd like to take good care of the manual transmission if I can.

Author:	DnvrJeepGuy [ Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:03 pm ]
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isutherl wrote: The KK comes in stick? Absolutely - my KK is a 6-speed manual with the trailer towing package.

Author:	DragonFly [ Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:
I came across this in my continuing research: http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/080227.htm

Author:	LEDfoot [ Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:29 pm ]
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If you look at European specifications the automatic and manual transmission models typically have the same tow ratings. Here in North America it is believed that you can't tow with a manual transmission.

Author:	cocojo [ Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:15 pm ]
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I don't own a KK yet but I am looking at them. I am interested in the 6 speed manual for gas mileage. I believe that the manual is geared to 321 compaired to 370 for the auto which puts more low end torque on the pull.

Author:	Khaki-KJ [ Mon Apr 28, 2008 6:20 pm ]
Post subject:
DragonFly wrote: I came across this in my continuing research: http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/080227.htm If I am reading this right, it has more to do with gear ratios than the actual transmission. The factory rear-end gears in my 2006 6 speed manual are 3.55 and the autos for 2006 are 3.73. Factor in the gear ratios in the transmissions and I am guessing this is why the tow ratings are different.

Author:	Khaki-KJ [ Mon Apr 28, 2008 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:
cocojo wrote: I don't own a KK yet but I am looking at them. I am interested in the 6 speed manual for gas mileage. I believe that the manual is geared to 321 compaired to 370 for the auto which puts more low end torque on the pull. For highway driving; The higher the gears - numerically lower, 3.55, the higher the top speed, better fuel economy, but less low end torque. The lower the gears, numerically higher, 4.11, the lower the top speed, less fuel economy, but greater low end torque. Drag racers use lower gears, 4.11 or 4.56 to get down the track as quickly as possible, at the highest possible speed with the quickest / hardest launch. If you used the higher gears, 3.55 or 3.21, you would take far longer to get down the same distance with a lower speed at the end and when you launched, it would not give you the same kick in the pants.

Author:	greenjeepster [ Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:
Where did you guys find the different tow specs? My six speed came with the factory class 3 hitch which is capable of withstanding 5000lbs but I didn't know the jeep it self was not able. Even though the jeep auto is rated at 5000 pounds I dont think I would do it. Even my dodge ram with the 5.9l v8 is not very fun to drive with 5000lbs hooked up to the back. Has anyone here tried towing that weight with there kk?

Author:	tjkj2002 [ Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:42 pm ]
Post subject:
greenjeepster wrote: Where did you guys find the different tow specs? My six speed came with the factory class 3 hitch which is capable of withstanding 5000lbs but I didn't know the jeep it self was not able. Even though the jeep auto is rated at 5000 pounds I dont think I would do it. Even my dodge ram with the 5.9l v8 is not very fun to drive with 5000lbs hooked up to the back. Has anyone here tried towing that weight with there kk? The towing info is in the owners manual.I have towed over 4000lbs with my auto KJ(45RFE tranny) on two 1500 miles trips,no problems.I also have towed over 5000lbs for about 30 miles with it.The manual tranny will have a lower tow rating from the clutch being the weak link in the KJ and KK,3500lbs(stick) vs 5000lbs(auto).

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Author:	cocojo [ Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:50 pm ]
Post subject:
There has to be a big difference in gas mileage with 6 speed manual and 321 gearing compaired to the auto which is only a 4 speed with 373 gears. Anyone ever drive both and notice a big diffenece off the line in torque and pull? Not a lot of options with the Liberty your stuck with what they give you and no other choices. A 4 speed auto not five. 321 gears for manual trannies and no options for locking differential. Only one engine choice. I loved the old Jeep inline 6 engine it was one of their best motors they ever made. It only had 190 HP and 230 Torque and that pulled quite well. My thinking is that the clutch and pressure plate along with 321 gearing dropped the tow rate down to 3500, which is still a lot of weight. Toung weight is the same.

Author:	tjkj2002 [ Tue Apr 29, 2008 5:39 pm ]
Post subject:
cocojo wrote: There has to be a big difference in gas mileage with 6 speed manual and 321 gearing compaired to the auto which is only a 4 speed with 373 gears. Anyone ever drive both and notice a big diffenece off the line in torque and pull? Not a lot of options with the Liberty your stuck with what they give you and no other choices. A 4 speed auto not five. 321 gears for manual trannies and no options for locking differential. Only one engine choice. I loved the old Jeep inline 6 engine it was one of their best motors they ever made. It only had 190 HP and 230 Torque and that pulled quite well. My thinking is that the clutch and pressure plate along with 321 gearing dropped the tow rate down to 3500, which is still a lot of weight. Toung weight is the same. You can regear to as low as 4.10's,stick or auto,and you can ad LSD's(which a crappy one was offered from the factory) or lockers.The higher gears in the stick are from the lower first couple of gear ratio's in the manual tranny,the lower gears in the auto are from the higher gears in the auto tranny.

Author:	LEDfoot [ Thu May 01, 2008 6:07 pm ]
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The clutch isn't weak, that is not the reason why the manual gets a lower rating. It just has to do with the guidelines that the government has set for tow ratings in the US vs other countries. Basically it has to do with it being harder to get going with a manual transmission than it is with an automatic transmission (thanks to the torque converter). To get a good tow rating with a manual transmission in the US you have to have a very low first gear ratio. Also, it's not really meaningful to discuss the different gearings in the axles if you are not taking into account the gear ratios in the transmissions as well. Just because the manual transmission have higher gear in the axle doesn't necessarily mean that they have a higher final gearing when you consider it from the output of the engine to the wheels.