VIN Discussion: ECU, TCU, flashes, interchangeability, etc

Gypsy62 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:56 pm

[These opening posts were transplanted from a hijack. Have at it!]

A. TKB4:
The problem I see is for tunes you have to have the VIN number of a foreign vehicle and since that VIN is only one that vehicle it wouldn't benefit any US CRD. Only way I could see is if skim etc could be cloned to have all vehicles using say an aftermarket non-approved tune to work with same programmed code as a foreign one but this is just common sense . I am specifically not telling anyone to do this.

Its similar to c-band/ku band satellite tv years ago or cloned phones or Roku etc.

B. My66dodge:
Ok since no one get it... the only thing that can be tuned that is a slave module (has no vin) is the TCM. It can be swapped from rig to rig without programming and is plug and play. The only thing you need to do after swapping the TCM is a quick learn with a scan tool. This is the only module you could have someone mail in for you to be programmed. As far as the ECM, it’s not worth the hassle to jump through the hoops to get a tune on it, it’s possible but you would have to change the vin in all the modules, ABS, ECM, BCM... you would have to change the vin before you mailed it off... and too boot it would be $$$ to have a reputable shop do this for you... so the only thing that can be programmed this way practically is the TCM. I have 2 TCM’s for my dads kJ crd so he can swap from tow tune to eco by just swapping them out. We talked about putting them both in and having a switch and some relays to switch between them but it would be more of a hassle than benefit.

C. TKB4:
Yes I have the GDE eco transmission tune and love it but when I checked at least a couple months ago they were not able to tune the transmission modules either. Basically anything not stock thats not certified can't be done by business. I would bet that the TCN s could be more or less cloned since they don't depend on the VIN.

D. My66dodge:
Nope... the TCM is a slave module so no vin in it... and GDE can tune a TCM, just not for anyone in this country

E. TKB4:
Exactly, like I said doesn't need VIN they are interchangeable between any 05 or 06 US CRD for sure. thats also why it might be possible to clone the program no VIN to match.

F. WWdiesel:
True, and if you swap another Jeep CRD TCM into your vehicle, I don't believe a "Relearn" is required. Changed mine last year and did not do a relearn and have had no issues.
I think the relearn is only required if your putting in a different TCM like from a Dodge etc...
Didn't SirSam mention he had the tools to tap into a TCM? Maybe he could copy a TCM program and flash it to a stock TCM?
I think it takes some special equipment to tap into them on a bench or have a Chrysler DRBIII tool to talk to the TCM? I will have to ask my Dodge mechanic friend who works for a big Dodge/Jeep dealer.

G. My66dodge:
Any time you modify the TCM or transmission or ECM tune, you need to do a quick learn so the TCM and ECM can relearn the clutch apply times to prevent shifting issues like 2 gears at once and shift times... you may never see the problems happen but I even do a quick learn after a transmission flush. It’s a quick procedure and never a bad idea.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2020 6:16 pm

I did talk to my mechanic friend who works at a large Dodge & Jeep dealership concerning flashing TCMs.
He informed he only has the ability to reflash a TCM with a current Mopar TCM flash.
He further informed me he does not have the ability to copy an existing (download or retrieve) the program off a TCM and then reuse it to reflash another TCM.
So I guess that is a dead end unfortunately. :cry:

TKB4 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2020 8:54 pm

maybe but just because he can't do it doesn't mean it cannot be done. I would be willing to wager there are people who could do it but whether its worth the time , risk etc for anyone to do it is another question.

Mountainman · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2020 9:56 pm

Sounds like the pre f37 or whatever it was TCU's are going to be the best transmission tunes available? I think masshole said that the Ram tcu's had shift points similar or the same as the pre f37 tune. ???

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 12:39 am

TKB4 wrote:

maybe but just because he can't do it doesn't mean it cannot be done. I would be willing to wager there are people who could do it but whether its worth the time , risk etc for anyone to do it is another question.

Did not say it cannot be done, just cannot be done by a dealer using their equipment. My understanding is it takes a specialized equipment to tap into the TCM on a bench to retrieve, reprogram, and then write back to the TCM with the new data.

Mountainman wrote:

Sounds like the pre f37 or whatever it was TCU's are going to be the best transmission tunes available? I think masshole said that the Ram tcu's had shift points similar or the same as the pre f37 tune. ???

Problem with Ram TCM's is the issue of over revving the little 2.8 diesel engine in some downshift situations.
Is there any device that will talk to the TCM and allow grabbing a copy of the TCM data via the OBDII port like we do on the ECM using the MPPS cable?

Mountainman · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:37 am

How much revving are you talking about?

Good question about the TCU, my guess is that we'd have to start asking the various companies that refurbish and sell ECU's (and tcu's?). Not sure if anyone specializes in the tcu's...

TKB4 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:14 pm

I think a company needs to open base in a less controlled country and sell to us market . If same TCU/ECU sold in other such countries I wonder why another company doesn't tap that market in addition to the US market. Especially for TCU since should are easier and same on our 05 and 06. I have to wonder how many similar automatic transmissions are used in other countries rather than manuals etc.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 4:00 pm

Mountainman wrote:

How much revving are you talking about?
Good question about the TCU, my guess is that we'd have to start asking the various companies that refurbish and sell ECU's (and tcu's?). Not sure if anyone specializes in the tcu's...

From a previous posts:

Post subject: 545rfe / BlueLghtning wrote:

My CRD had a low mileage Dodge Ram 545RFE Transmission and Torque Converter put in before I bought it. I have zero shudder and have both the ECO & Hot Tunes and it seems to handle them fine. I really do want the GDE trans tune myself as I also find myself trying to drive around the shift points to get better mileage. I think the GDE trans tune would be exactly what I need and get those locks ups and hold them.
I also tried the Dodge Ram TCM since it came with my Jeep. It does hit the higher gears sooner and locks up the torque converter at lower RPM's, but it does have a few nuances though. It will hold 1st/2nd longer (2k+), but you can shift around letting up on the gas and forcing it to shift. The Dodge Ram TCM seems to stay in the 3rd the least amount of time, but that's easy to force by using the O/D button. It definitely hits 4th & 5th at lower RPM's than the CRD TCM. However, the biggest thing I didn't like and why I pulled it out was the risk of over revving the engine on a kick down shift and getting stuck in that 4k+ RPM range where the Diesel stops fueling and you have to let up on the gas to get it to shift up again. For me, I think the money for the trans tune will be well worth the money.

Post subject: Re: Ram Transmission Control Module (TCM) users and results / ChooChooman74 wrote:

I like some features. I still won't tow a camper with it for fear of overrevving the engine. I do like the line pressures. I think Giordi has sent his to keith. I am hoping he can learn from it and make an improved tow tune.

flash7210 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 7:47 pm

I’ve been using the hemi TCM for a few years now.
And all the above is true.

However, once you get used to it’s shift characteristics it’s manageable.
For instance, if you’re cruising at 70 mph and want to make a move to pass someone, don’t just mash the throttle because it’ll downshift all the way to 3rd.
Instead, slowly roll into the throttle and it will hold 5th gear.
Also, get used to switching the overdrive on and off.

When towing you’re gonna spend most of time with OD-off. Especially over hilly terrain.
It’ll drive just fine, towing, at 55-60 mph with OD-off.
Over long flat terrain you can turn OD back on.

Highway driving while towing is just like off-roading. Read the terrain. Pick your line. Maneuver safely. Speed will likely get you killed.

All that said, I do most of my driving over flat terrain and rarely tow

flash7210 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 24, 2020 7:53 pm

And if you don’t like any of the factory TCM options, you can always install a programmable stand-alone module.
https://www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com/Performance_Aftermarket/Products/Transmission_Products/TCM2000_Transmission_Controller/

VIN Discussion: ECU, TCU, flashes, interchangeability, etc

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