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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 1:19 am 
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Not everyone has the same cam seals however... Some have a one-time-use plug on the back, others have a threaded cap. There aren't "bearings" as such in there, they are just oil cushioned, so as long as you aren't cooking it, they should be fine staying in place.

Sinking the whole thing in diesel fuel works well too - especially if you can leave it to marinate for a few days. This is how the TDI guys clean theirs.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:30 pm 
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Here is how I got the head out of the engine bay.

Image

Cylinder #1-#4
Image

Image

Image

Image

Ceramic glow plugs are all intact. And will be in place.

The question I have is, cyl #1 not at TDC as shown in the pictures. Yet, the timing pin is in place in the flywheel.... When this things goes back together, I need proper timing. Where do I go for that?

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 12:33 am 
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Someone correct me if i am wrong but i am pretty sure that when the flywheel is pinned, piston 1 should be at 90 degrees past tdc

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 1:32 am 
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Your engine is exactly correct. All 4 cylinders are in the midpoint of their travel, and at the moment (since there is no head and no cams) there is no intake or exhaust stroke. So you are 90 ATDC on #1.

Mark the top of the crank hub with a paint pen right now, it will be helpful later when you are rotating everything by hand. The crank pin is not so critical later as knowing that you have the hub holes at vertical and horizontal, with that 90ATDC mark staring at you. The factory mark is nearly impossible to see while working on it.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 5:50 am 
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You should take the head to a machine shop to have it pressure tested and checked for cracks.

Looks like cyljnders 3 and 4 had water in them. Which seems pretty typical for engines with a blown head gasket or cracked head.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 1:04 pm 
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That could also just be from lifting the head off - there will usually be some drainage from the oil and water jackets.

Looking at the pictures, it actually looks to me like the wet cylinders are #2 and #3.


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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:56 pm 
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I see now.
I assumed he posted the pics in order from top to bottom 1-4.
Now I see they are top to bottom 4-1.
The arrows on the pistons were the clue.

#4 looks good.
But what is all that rust looking crud on #1 ?

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:20 pm 
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flash7210 wrote:
I see now.
I assumed he posted the pics in order from top to bottom 1-4.
Now I see they are top to bottom 4-1.
The arrows on the pistons were the clue.

#4 looks good.
But what is all that rust looking crud on #1 ?


Probably crystalized coolant, ive seen it form on another diesel i owned that sat awhile before i got it.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 6:28 am 
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Another tip for getting the crank rotated & aligned easier. When I had the crank in position I pulled the flywheel access plug (right near the starter) and put a mark on the flywheel & adjacent bellhousing. Then when you're ready to put things back together just use that mark for a quick reference. Its much easier to see when you're rolling the crank over by hand (with a wrench) and since the mark is like 18inches off the centerline of rotation (vs. the crank hub mark) it is much easier to get it spot on - at least to the point where you can easily insert the flywheel pin. For me all of the this was super easy because I had the engine out and sitting on an engine stand. In that situation you can actually see the flywheel timing hole and get it perfectly aligned - to where you can easily screw the flywheel timing pin in by hand. Then I paint marked the flywheel in the access hole (opposite side of the flywheel).

Also, since you have the lift - reassemble the head, exhaust manifold, turbo and oil drainback tube. Set the whole assembly back onto the block with the lift. Once you get the head to within about an inch of sitting down on the block - work the oil drainback tube into its rubber seal on the side of the block (it has a flex section in it). Works like a charm. Plus getting the exhaust manifold & turbo reassembled and torqued sitting on the bench vs. bending over the fender is much easier and more pleasant.

For the intake reinstall - get yourself 2 long bolts the same size as the factory one. Cut off the head and grind a point on the shaft (just below where you cut the head off). Screw them into the head. These will act as guide pins and insure you get the manifold dropped onto the head straight down so as to nit disturb any of the rockers. You'll see once you start the reassembly process. Make certain that with the ground points they are just long enough to poke up thru the manifold to where you can get at them to unscrew them once the intake is in place. Check my build thread (towards the last few pages). There are lots of pics. GL


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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:51 pm 
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Thanks everyone,

Had the head pressure tested today at the local machine shop... They say no cracks. Never saw a head like the CRD they said, the owner of the shop (old guy, grey hair) said it must have been a "swap." Once I convinced him it wasn't and that CD sold them in 05-06 in the US, he called the Chrysler guys to check my story. He asked if I wanted the head resurfaced, and I told him it couldn't be because of the tolerances... He confirmed it with the guy on the other end of the phone fwiw... But, kinda sounded legit, the guy knew there were 3 thicknesses of head gaskets.

Have the head back and in for a good scrubbing tomorrow to get all the old material off. Same for the block. Intake is marinading in diesel...

Yes I screwed up posting the cylinder pics... they are 4-1 not 1-4... Sorry.

What gasket spray should I use? Shop man says get the Mopar gasket spray from stealership... Sprays red, gets tacky....

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:57 pm 
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geordi wrote:
Here's my research thread, thanks for your data!

You have already made the right decision though, putting in the studs.

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=79984


Sorry, I didn't get bolt data. The torque wrenches we have only click going clockwise...That is, unless they all had less than 25lb of torque.

I can say, some came out very, very easy.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 11:10 pm 
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I almost forgot,

How much play side to side can/should the turbo have. Now that it is off, when I stick my fingers in the hub, from side to side (front to back) there is like 1/8" or so play.

Does not seem to be much wobble or up and down like a bearing loose. When she was running, you could still hear her spool up. Not as much whine as I have heard in the past, but still the nice turbo "woosh"

Speaking of wobble, all of the rocker bearings seemed to be "fine" with no play. regardless, I am replacing them.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2016 9:35 am 
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DadsDiesel wrote:
Thanks everyone,

Had the head pressure tested today at the local machine shop... They say no cracks. Never saw a head like the CRD they said, the owner of the shop (old guy, grey hair) said it must have been a "swap." Once I convinced him it wasn't and that CD sold them in 05-06 in the US, he called the Chrysler guys to check my story. He asked if I wanted the head resurfaced, and I told him it couldn't be because of the tolerances... He confirmed it with the guy on the other end of the phone fwiw... But, kinda sounded legit, the guy knew there were 3 thicknesses of head gaskets.

Have the head back and in for a good scrubbing tomorrow to get all the old material off. Same for the block. Intake is marinading in diesel...

Yes I screwed up posting the cylinder pics... they are 4-1 not 1-4... Sorry.

What gasket spray should I use? Shop man says get the Mopar gasket spray from stealership... Sprays red, gets tacky....



Hi there,
My local garage is pricing up a head gasket replacement for me. Just rang for an update and they're waiting on a price for the head to be pressure tested and "skimmed".
Can the CRD heads be skimmed/resurfaced? Mine is a 2003 2.5CRD (UK)

Cheers, Stu


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 Post subject: Re: Smoke on start-up once warm smoke gone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2016 11:44 am 
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Fern30 wrote:
DadsDiesel wrote:
Thanks everyone,

Had the head pressure tested today at the local machine shop... They say no cracks. Never saw a head like the CRD they said, the owner of the shop (old guy, grey hair) said it must have been a "swap." Once I convinced him it wasn't and that CD sold them in 05-06 in the US, he called the Chrysler guys to check my story. He asked if I wanted the head resurfaced, and I told him it couldn't be because of the tolerances... He confirmed it with the guy on the other end of the phone fwiw... But, kinda sounded legit, the guy knew there were 3 thicknesses of head gaskets.

Have the head back and in for a good scrubbing tomorrow to get all the old material off. Same for the block. Intake is marinading in diesel...

Yes I screwed up posting the cylinder pics... they are 4-1 not 1-4... Sorry.

What gasket spray should I use? Shop man says get the Mopar gasket spray from stealership... Sprays red, gets tacky....



Hi there,
My local garage is pricing up a head gasket replacement for me. Just rang for an update and they're waiting on a price for the head to be pressure tested and "skimmed".
Can the CRD heads be skimmed/resurfaced? Mine is a 2003 2.5CRD (UK)

Cheers, Stu


There is not much room for shaving the head. The valve seats are almost flush with the surface. Maybe can cut 0.002" at most.

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