[quote="Gris"][quote="jcphoto20"]could someone please explain why there was a difference at all, and especially since it was showing 7mpg difference?[/quote]

Wind? Where the external wind conditions the exact same on both trips? I know that when I feel a strong gust hit the jeep the instant, expecially head on, it drops the MPG downa good chunk.


Here's a general idea we should all follow. When one person says the exact opposite of what every person who has ever tested a product, including leading magazines following everything from import tuners to deisel super-trucks, we should all just nod our heads, and simply say:

"You are entitled to your opinion. Although the aforementioned product has time and again proved it's lack of improvment and in most cases, caused a LOSS of efficiency, once again you have the rare experience of owner the one unique vehicle that defies the laws of physics."


Instead of arguing points over and over with the one single person that owns the unique vehicle mentioned above.[/quote]


wind? NO, i said repeatedly the measurement for each configuration was the same in both directions down the same exact road, same exact speed within 10 minutes. if it was wind, it would have had a higher reading one direction than the other. so no wind wasnt it. (read the conditions of my test again)

i seriously doubt that any import tuner or diesel truck magazine would do a test on one of those products to find out what mileage gains you would see at steady highway speeds. those were the specific conditions of my test . typically those tests show a FULL THROTTLE dyno test and maybe a ballpark mileage figure saying they gained or lost a mpg or two towing a trailer. neither of which are relevant to the test that i described. and im willing to bet that you have never seen any of the tests and are just guessing and making up what you think everyone else here would like to hear just for the purpose of discrediting me. i have no intention of discrediting anyone or making anyone feel bad.

and thank you so much for saying it was my opinion, how i am unreliable since everyone else you heard about says the contrary. that would be YOUR Opinion. i was stating FACTS and asking for an informed, useful response. i was not looking for another flame from another flamer. please read my signature.

on your mythbuster acetone blow off... they have been wrong before, and this is another instance where they are wrong. acetone in your gas does increase your mileage at least 1mpg. and it makes your engine run smoother which you can hear and feel before you get home from the gas station.

again im asking for useful information, not just some jerky's negative 2 cent burn on me. im not shook, yur not hurting my feelings. i feel so priviledged that my jeep defies the laws of physics, i must be the man.

someone with something useful to say would be appreciated, flamers please take a powder

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thank you

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It may be that your only purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.

06 CRD Sport
Built 5/11/06
Jeep Green
Rocklizard diff cover
V6 Airbox

[quote="sleeve84028"]I don't want to argue about long intake runner length, air atomization, intake charge & temperature or port velocities. But if any type of "electric supercharger" or turbo-tornado generator was really that effective at increasing the MPG figures in a vehicle the engineers that design & build those cars would be using them to meet C.A.F.E requirements. I've yet to see any car, truck or SUV produced with a similar device.[/quote]


actually i know for a fact that an 89 gmc 350 tbi (i think thats the year, the girl that lived with us for a while had one) has an immobile fan type vortex generator in that big lump in the intake tube. so yes they have used them before. im sure there are others. i actually took it off, and its still in my garage. that was a couple years ago when i believed the same thing most of you have been led to believe. i wish i would have left it there.

and thank you scoobybri, i believe you are probably right. i just figured as simple and quick as my test was that perhaps someone else on this entire board somewhere must be able to do the same test or provide more info.

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Now that is funny, and in a forum with a title including the phrase "junk science" no less.

Could you post a pic of it? I have worked on more '75-'97 Chevey 350's then I care to admit and have never seen anything you have described.Everthing from camaro's to 1-ton pick-ups with both carburated and TBI 350's.'89 350's are TBI and have thge same style air filter/housing as older carburated engines(untill '94 or '95 if I remenber right) since the TBI is a carburator with injectors.I would like to see a pic of it since I neither can find anything OEM like that or have every heard of it being(or seeing) OEM in GM vehicles.Please post a pic and I'll shut up,and many others will to.Scooybri,you are correct on the ECM issue so it's a losing battle about if those things work or you would see them come factory in all vehicles.To get better MPG's has alot to do with how you drive,In my case I have a 100lbs right foot so I'll never see good MPG.I'm not to concerned about fuel mileage,I plan on using as much gas as I can before it's all gone .

[quote="Pablo"][quote="Jeger"]thank you[/quote]

Now that is funny, and in a forum with a title including the phrase "junk science" no less.[/quote]

except for the x2 burn, you are my hero with the Aeroturbine muffler. that is definately on my list, i should see at least 21mpg in my 3.7 all the time with that.

you guys can laugh or make all the jokes you want, but my physics defying liberty responds to everything i have thrown at it.

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MUDD'S MOTORSPORT'S We do IFS lift installs ,
03 OVERLAND EDITION /Kilby-Skidrow-Mopar-4XGuard skids/ 2.5 inch TOTAL CONTROL JBA coilovers -JBA Arms/MOABS-31 FALKEN WILDPEAK AT3W / 4.10's etc, 04 Kilimanjaro Edition loaded, plus 05 KJ limited

I'd like some peanut butter to sooth the burns! (sorry all - i couldn't help it)

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USA Spec I-Pod adaptor, Mopar Sub, Garmin GPS
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MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Peanut Butter,got some grape jelly?

ok if you kids are through, how about gettin back to the point of the discussion?

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Got any pics yet?

Yes, please get back to SavageUrge's original question, gentlemen. The Air Razor and Velocity Tuner. Do they really work or not? These particular products.

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New KJ Gear - Desert Armor Flak

2004 Renegade Light Khaki - 4" JBA Lift - Rock Lizard Products: Komodo Dragon Rear Bumper, Prototype Winch-mount Front Bumper, Super Skink Sliders - All J's Super Tranny Skid II - 31" Firestone Destination AT's on Moab wheels - Cobra 75W CB w/ stock Antenna mod

[b]Retired, US Military

Make a poll - we can all vote that way.

My vote: No

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02 Liberty Limited
Silver Outside & Taupe Inside
Heated Seats, Sunroof & Infinity speakers
USA Spec I-Pod adaptor, Mopar Sub, Garmin GPS
Tow Package, Select-Trac
Rock Rails, Tow Hooks

I'm with you.My vote= NO.

SECOND THAT VOTE, yes I was screaming it

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MUDD'S MOTORSPORT'S We do IFS lift installs ,
03 OVERLAND EDITION /Kilby-Skidrow-Mopar-4XGuard skids/ 2.5 inch TOTAL CONTROL JBA coilovers -JBA Arms/MOABS-31 FALKEN WILDPEAK AT3W / 4.10's etc, 04 Kilimanjaro Edition loaded, plus 05 KJ limited

voting on this topic is more useless than (some guys ID). once again you are making things up, guessing, giving your opinion about a topic that you have no knowledge of.

there was supposed to be a meaningful discussion about vortex generators.

you people are obviously unwilling to accept anyones real experience with another similar device that actually does work. its too bad im the only one that had any real information to provide.

but instead of a bunch of you pulling out more conjecture from where the sun doesnt shine, how about noone post any messages on this topic unless you actually buy one of those two devices mentioned?

people that are here to learn something thank you.

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My guess would be that if it does increase mpg, it does it by restricting the air flow. The computer would compensate with less fuel to keep the afr correct. It doesn't take much power to drive at a constant speed on the highway compared to accelerating from 0-60. The resulting drop in power shouldn't be noticeable at a constant speed. I'd be interested in seeing some averages from daily driving, dyno numbers, and quarter mile times. If it increases milage and power, could it be creating a venturi effect? There are definately things that can increase mpg, but most are easily offset by the cost of the modification verses the cost of gas. My hood increased my highway gas milage by over 15%, but it takes a lot of highway miles to make up for the cost. Especially considering most of my driving is stop and go in the city, and I have a serious case of lead foot.

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Frankenlift II Premium, Al's Upper Arms, 245/75R16 C Silent Armors on Moabs, RL Skink Super Sliders, Rear DTT, Riddler Diff Cover, Fastman Throttle Body, Profinish-Proglass Hood, Borla Dual Outlet Exhaust, TransGo Reprogramming Kit, APS Stall Converter, 4.10 Gears, B&G Chrysler PCM, Lots of Line-X, etc...

You buy it and we will try it.

jcphoto,

As you mention, only people with experience with the exact products can give opinions.

Your product is not the same product. As many products that are similar that are produced around the world, they rarely produce the same results. Even when the product is made by the same company and is the same product, they do not always perform the same. An example is computer components. They are given the same rating but are not producing the same results even in the lab.

All:
It doesn't look like there is anyone on here that has used these products. Do a Google/Yahoo/Ask Jeeves or whatever search on the internet for independent data on those products. Contact Consumer Reports to see if they have done testing. If you can't find any, purchase and use at your own risk and be the guinea pig for the rest of the world.

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New KJ Gear - Desert Armor Flak

2004 Renegade Light Khaki - 4" JBA Lift - Rock Lizard Products: Komodo Dragon Rear Bumper, Prototype Winch-mount Front Bumper, Super Skink Sliders - All J's Super Tranny Skid II - 31" Firestone Destination AT's on Moab wheels - Cobra 75W CB w/ stock Antenna mod

[b]Retired, US Military

with that message i was tryin to limit the discussion to those two products, i wasnt going to mention mine or any of that anymore. i know mine works, i only wanted to know why and noone could tell me. this only led to everyone bashing the only guy with anything useful to lend to the thread.

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