Patriot or Liberty?

JohnnyCash · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 11:30 am

I was reading a review of the Patriot and it got me thinking.
You can buy a Trail-Rated Patriot for the same price as a Trail-Rated Liberty.

With the Patriot you get:
-All-Wheel-Drive.
-Better Clearance because there is no Transfer Case.
-You can instantly shift into 4-Low by just pulling up a little lever. No need to be rolling and no need to be in 4-Low until you absolutely need it.
-A little better gas mileage.

With the Liberty you can:
-Tow more

Any other advantages for the Liberty over the Patriot?
I'm trying to talk my ladyfriend into buying a Patriot so I can play with it. Already have a Liberty.

hyedipin · **Joined:** Thu May 11, 2006 10:20 am **Posts:** 1667

FWD while in 2WD is enough for me not to buy it over liberty. (if i was in the market for a new jeep) otherwise, if it was a second jeep, I would go get the cheaper patriot model..

You made your point when you said they cost almost the same.

I thought you were talking about KJ
-You can instantly shift into 4-Low by just pulling up a little lever. No need to be rolling and no need to be in 4-Low until you absolutely need it.
because I switch to 4LO while standing all the time just by pulling a little lever, and it works perfectly fine. No need to be rolling.

Brigrat · **Joined:** Sun May 21, 2006 6:17 pm **Posts:** 92

lets not forget that the Patriot 4wd system is clutch based like a LSD. It is untested, and will likely need a cllutch repack shortly after the warantee expires...

Jase3gt · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 12:45 pm

I just test drove the Patriot and then bought my Liberty 2 weeks ago. The patriot is built to be a car. It's the same as the Compass. The new transmission, CVT I think it's called, doesn't shift. It revs really high and then evens out so you don't feel that traditional shift. So if you step on the gas like when you're getting on the highway it almost red lines and then settles back down after a few seconds. It's different. Also the only reason that the trail rated Patriot is trail rated is because they added some really low gearing to it to make it crawl at like 1/2 a mph. Otherwise none of the other versions of the Patriot are trail rated you have to get the one with the Freedom Drive II. And the 4x4 version is not totally FWD. It's AWD. It switches on it's own between FWD and AWD. The little lever locks it into AWD if you need it, like for driving on snow.
The Liberty is actually a more traditional 4WD system. And it's really trail rated. It's also larger so you have more interior room. The Patriot is only a 4 cylinder and the new Libertys are all V-6's. So you will definitely feel the difference driving the two.
The Patriot was pretty comfortable ride but that is because it rides like a car and not an SUV. It has a decent interior too, especially if you get the limited. The one I test drove was fully loaded with leather seats and the DVD Navigation system and Boston Acoustics 9 speaker sound system. It's the only jeep vehicle with that exact Boston Acoustics system too I think. I couldn't find any of the other vehicles with it unless the Commander has it. I didn't really look at them.
Hope that helps. Definitely test drive the two of them yourself so you can compare the differences.

JohnnyCash · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 12:53 pm

Jase3gt wrote:

I just test drove the Patriot and then bought my Liberty 2 weeks ago. The patriot is built to be a car. It's the same as the Compass. The new transmission, CVT I think it's called, doesn't shift. It revs really high and then evens out so you don't feel that traditional shift. So if you step on the gas like when you're getting on the highway it almost red lines and then settles back down after a few seconds. It's different. Also the only reason that the trail rated Patriot is trail rated is because they added some really low gearing to it to make it crawl at like 1/2 a mph. Otherwise none of the other versions of the Patriot are trail rated you have to get the one with the Freedom Drive II. And the 4x4 version is not totally FWD. It's AWD. It switches on it's own between FWD and AWD. The little lever locks it into AWD if you need it, like for driving on snow.
The Liberty is actually a more traditional 4WD system. And it's really trail rated. It's also larger so you have more interior room. The Patriot is only a 4 cylinder and the new Libertys are all V-6's. So you will definitely feel the difference driving the two.
The Patriot was pretty comfortable ride but that is because it rides like a car and not an SUV. It has a decent interior too, especially if you get the limited. The one I test drove was fully loaded with leather seats and the DVD Navigation system and Boston Acoustics 9 speaker sound system. It's the only jeep vehicle with that exact Boston Acoustics system too I think. I couldn't find any of the other vehicles with it unless the Commander has it. I didn't really look at them.
Hope that helps. Definitely test drive the two of them yourself so you can compare the differences.

I test drove both a while ago. I chose the Liberty, but I could have gotten either one. Liked them both. The Liberty seemed more durable, but I don't have anything to back that up. I was surprised that the Patriot had as much get up 'n go as it did when I test drove it. Really seemed to accelerate well. I don't know what it was, but the Liberty just felt like a higher-quality vehicle to me. Can't explain it. But now I want the ladyfriend to buy a Patriot so I can drive it too. I feel like she should get one if she cares about me at all.

sleeve84028 · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 12:53 pm

It's interesting to note that the 4cylinder MT patriot is claimed to be faster 0-60 than the V6 Auto Liberty... I like the Patriot.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 1:27 pm

I think the Patriot would be a kewl little vehicle to modify toward a "rally car/suv" style vehicle. It would do pretty well on washboard surfaces and offroad Jeep Roads. The mileage they advertize is always the 2wd models with the smaller engine/mt. The Trail Rated version gets only margianlly better than the 3.7L...but every little bit helps. The KJ weights about 900# more than the Trail Rated Patriot which does make it feel better built IMHO. I know that the KJ is tuff when it comes to rollovers...lol.

I think they should have skipped the Compass all together...put a diesel (2.0-2.2L) in an affordable package like the Patriot...instead of the $40,000+ Grand Cherokee (and that won't be long with the buy-out...I bet you see very few GC CRDs now with the selling of "C" or "DC").

Anyway, back to the Patriot vs the Liberty. I like the older 2002-2007 KJs better...probably in part from familiarity...but the new Patriot vs the 2008 KK Liberty...don't know yet. Now that I have the CRD, I am "stuck on diesel".

priell3 · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 2:32 pm

We looked at but did not drive a Trail Rated Patriot. It had a belly full of armor, was good looking,
and priced at only $23K. Decided on the JK Unlimited for more room and the ability to go topless. :twisted:

Sport · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 3:46 pm

I wonder how it would do in deep sand like the beach or dunes. Can the trail rated version get through it?

spencevans · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 4:19 pm

It's like comparing apples to oranges. The Liberty is much more trail capable than the Patriot. The Liberty has several up sides that the Patriot does not.

1. Gear Ratio: For any serious offroading you must have atleast a 30:1 gear ratio. This gives the driver control in crawling in tricky situations, and going up and downhills.

2. Articulation. This is what help maintain traction and balance while off road. Most of the Libertys flex comes from it's live rear axle. The Patriot has independent front and rear suspension which means no flex. It will wheel like a car, not a truck.

3. Engine torque. While not necessary in most situations, occasionally it is helpful in the sand, mud and other situations. Engine torque is also compounded by the gear ratio. Poor gear ratio equals poor torque.

All in all the Patriot is a good ride but making the comparison to the Liberty is totally unfair. It's like comparing the Liberty to a Wrangler Rubicon.

Johnny the CRD Libby will get better fuel milage than the Patriot, The Libby does have all time 4 wheel and ground clearence is debatable.
Oh by the way I would love to see a stock Patriot do a real trail like Moab Rim or the Rubicon like the stock Libby did.

jason thompson · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 5:54 pm

spencevans wrote:

It's like comparing apples to oranges. The Liberty is much more trail capable than the Patriot. The Liberty has several up sides that the Patriot does not.

1. Gear Ratio: For any serious offroading you must have atleast a 30:1 gear ratio. This gives the driver control in crawling in tricky situations, and going up and downhills.

2. Articulation. This is what help maintain traction and balance while off road. Most of the Libertys flex comes from it's live rear axle. The Patriot has independent front and rear suspension which means no flex. It will wheel like a car, not a truck.

3. Engine torque. While not necessary in most situations, occasionally it is helpful in the sand, mud and other situations. Engine torque is also compounded by the gear ratio. Poor gear ratio equals poor torque.

All in all the Patriot is a good ride but making the comparison to the Liberty is totally unfair. It's like comparing the Liberty to a Wrangler Rubicon.

Johnny the CRD Libby will get better fuel milage than the Patriot, The Libby does have all time 4 wheel and ground clearence is debatable.
Oh by the way I would love to see a stock Patriot do a real trail like Moab Rim or the Rubicon like the stock Libby did.

I agree 100%
The biggest differance that is being over looked is the little leaver with the letters that look like this
2 HI - 4 HI \ 4 LO with out this little leaver you can give up any REAL trail riding
it may be fine on dirt 2 tracks but try this line in a Patriot

at the bottom

at the top

This is a STOCK KJ and it drug bumper going up and skid plates at the top and needed every bit of 4LO it had

spencevans · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 6:06 pm

IMO the Liberty would be worthless offroad if it did not have the live rear axle and transfer case.

Tokyojoe · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 7:44 pm

I don't agree about the better clearance due to not having the T-case.

With armor on, there is no loss of clearance on the KJ compared to the Patriot. The armor is almost level from front engine skid, across the tranny skid, to the T-case skid.

robert46123 · **Posted:** Fri May 25, 2007 10:27 pm

One advantage with the transfer case is we can tow it behind our motorhome.

InCommando · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 5:08 am

Did I miss someone mentioning that the Patriot is a re-bodied Caliber?

I am not knocking the Patriot. It is fine for what it is. I hope it picks up some sales for jeep in a new segment. But at the end of the day you have front-wheel-drive econobox ( neon gen II ). The KJ is arguably better than the XJ in stock form in every area but front diff strength. It is more of a unibodied truck base than a fwd car base.

How many Foresters do you see hitting it on the trails? Mistsu EVO's? Imprezza's? All of them are much closer to the compass/patriot than the Kj, and are much better suited to rally-type events than what most consider off-roading. Yet Sub & Mitsu do not claim those as off-roaders. And the patriot is a Jeep Forester while the compass is a Jeep Imprezza, no matter how jeep wants to spin it.

DaveKJ02 · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 5:54 am

"Trail Rated"? People around here keep saying that, and I cant help but laugh how much a marketing scheme worked.

You can just buy better "Trail Tested" edition badge right here to prove your rig is to be taken seriously, even if it shouldnt.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 8:06 am

It is not "that it worked" and people here are "fooled"...it is just a term that differentiates between 4WD systems in this instance :roll:

I think everyone here knows that it is a marketing term...so is "JEEP" but we need to use that "marketing term" also.

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 8:23 am

I think the best way to classify the JEEP vehicles is by using BEER

Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon...Guiness (Stout and Full)

Wrangler Rubicon..................Bass (Never lets you down)

Wrangler 4x4........................Samuel Adams (has a nose for trails)

Grand Cherokee 4x4..............Spaten Oktoberfest (Don't see it offroad that much, but it can if it wants to)

Grand Cherokee CRD.............Heineken (because of the Germans selling out, we won't see many here...too bad, it could have been Spaten Optimator)

Commander 4x4....................Shiner (Tries to be a darker beer but the color comes from added caramel)

Liberty 4x4............................St Pauli Girl (it might look like a "Chic Jeep" but it will get ya' a BUZZ)

Liberty CRD..........................Black and Tan (It starts out as a Tan beer but the "diesel" turns it Black)

Patriot "Trail Rated"...............Miller Lite (It still has "some" beer qualities, just less calories)

Compass 4x4........................O'Douls (worse than "near beer")

Of course, you can change the Beer choices based on personal preference :idea:

itsajeepthing · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 8:32 am

LOL!! That was great!

Tokyojoe · **Posted:** Sat May 26, 2007 9:52 am

Wally.....very good!

I like to call the KJ, a Fat Tire Amber Ale (looks good, tastes good, and goes down smooth...even during rough times).

For those of you that do not do microbrews and have not had the opportunity to try Fat Tire, you are missing out.

Patriot or Liberty?

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