DC is denying warranty on the injection pump due to CAT2!!!

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:39 pm

OK the light bulb just went off :idea:

The wiring harness from the engine on 06 models is routed highter then the 05 models. On the 06 the cable from the engine rubs a sharp edge on the fuel filter head bracket. it has been known to cause shorts. On the 05 models it's slightly lower and hits the bracket on the rounded over edge. Since the bracket was most likely off during the cat update and your saying there's tape on it I would remove all the tape and check for a cut wire. To my knowledge there was never a tech bulliten on it but it was know over on the Jeepforum. I have a slit piece of hose over the edge on the barcket on mine. Also there's a wire down lower on the engine that bubs on something also but I'm not sure where.

chadhargis · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:47 pm

Quote:

Imagine what I could have arranged if I'd been able to use the boobies to sway things in my favour

Heck...wish *I* could help you in some way. LOL!

drharv · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:47 pm

Threeweight - he's not lucky - I just want my Jetta back :!:

Joe - can you give me an idiot's version of how to check that? Mike will crap his pants if I can find the issue before he gets home (not likely, but a girl can dream, right?).

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:01 pm

drharv wrote:

Threeweight - he's not lucky - I just want my Jetta back :!:

Joe - can you give me an idiot's version of how to check that? Mike will crap his pants if I can find the issue before he gets home (not likely, but a girl can dream, right?).

On top of the engine there's a large harness and the rear part turns toward the fuel filter bracket. On the 06 models it hits the square corner of the bracket and rubbs the insulation off causing shorts. I can send a picture in about a hour if you can't find where I'm discribing. To check it take the non factory tape off and look at the wires. If you need a picture send a email to jromas AT columbus DOT rr DOT com Leaving spaces out and putting DOTTS in

drharv · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:12 pm

Okay, I climbed up with the trouble light and had a peek. If I'm looking at it from the passenger side toward the fuel filter head bracket, I see the big mesh-wrapped bunch of wires in behind the bracket that the filter head is bolted to - is the sharp edge on the the L-shaped bit in behind that? It looks to me like there is tape over the end of the mesh wrap, but "exposed" (as in, not taped or wrapped) wires heading parallel to the edge of the engine compartment further toward the driver's side. Is that where I should be looking? Maybe I should just let Mike use the ohmmeter on the wire to the pressure control valve first - I don't want to get myself into trouble, kwim? FWIW, the taped part at the end of the mesh looks a like it's coming undone. Not sure if it's non-factory as there are other wires under the hood that appear to have factory-looking tape at the end of their mesh wraps. The plastic housing over the rest of the harness is all catty-wampous with obvious "after-market" black tape though. Maybe that's what the dealer is going to use as defense for nixing the warranty?? :lol:

Non-OEM black tape?

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:14 pm

Joe is right, there were two different issues on both of those wire harness problem talked about here about December '05 to maybe April '06 with photos of one of them. If I could ever find anything in the search mode of the Forum I would look for it for you.

Mrs. Mikey...can you change oil and grease a New Holland swather? :lol:

drharv · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:24 pm

Changed my own oil until Mikey came along - and he kills bees for me now, too. As to the other, not sure I can say I've greased a swather (unless its the machine with all the feckin' nipples in a row on the side facing the tractor - I might be confusing it with an ancient square baler I spent too many days behind), But I have been known to use a 12V grease gun to lube up a 1845 CASE bobcat. Does that count?

I'm going to troll back a bunch of pages and see if I can find those posts. thanks!

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:29 pm

I just peeked at mine again and the 06 seems to be lower then the 05. The top of the filter bracket on the side closest to the engine is bent over on the top half of it. The 05 harness is up there. On the 06 the barness is lower and constantly rubbing on the engine side edge of the bracket below where it's bent over. There's tape on my harness where the mesh stops to hold the mesh then a big wad behind the filter. The problem is where the harness bends to go behind the bracket. I'm still looking for the threads. If I find them I'll add it.

Ranger1 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:40 pm **Posts:** 1137

Quote:

That said, the dude from Lewiston says he strongly suspects its the pressure control valve at the rear of the rail that has failed

As RFCRD posted earlier, this pressure control valve seems more likely to have failed than the pump, based on reported failure history. There have been 2 or 3 failures of this valve on CRD's that have been posted in the last year or so, on various sites. If it fails open, it will bypass the fuel back to the tank before it can build any significant pressure in that rail on the top of the engine. While you would think it would set a code, we know from experience that some transmissions fail without any codes being set either, so its still more likely than the pump I would think.

The wiring issue you mention is somewhat problematic, due to the dealership history Mike has already posted. If that tech messed with the wiring harness, it could well be he introduced a new problem.

drharv · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:16 pm

RANGER1 step to the front of the class! After testing the rail solenoid dealie ( Bosch-Pressure Control Valve) on the firewall side of the rail; and another discussion with Robin in Lewiston (the only guy west of the Pecos that can test common rail injectors and pumps) have lead me back to the "bypass valve". Robin had been discussing this case with a colleague in Seattle (to whom Cowcatcher was kind enough to contact) both of whom had recently completed Bosch Common Rail school, and the came to the consensus that the MPROP (DC calls it a fuel quantity solenoid) is responsible for the initial rail pressure. It determines the low to high side flow and controls the initial high pressure. The PCV only "trims" the rail pressure to match the operating conditions. Again her reiterated that it is highly unlikely that the pump failed. He went as far to say that even if it ingested a significant amount of thread locker it would barely even hiccup, even if it ingest a significant amount of abrasive material the pump would become less efficient but not fail completely. I metered out the PCV wiring and looked for any signs of chafing and found nothing amiss.

SO you say. A new MPROP is about $450 and I will order one tomorrow ( maybe same day but surely within a few). Installation is a snap and I will know what is up shortly after that. I appreciate all of the members of this forum more than you can imagine. Without this community another CRD owner would be at the totally incompetent dealer's mercy.

After the beast is running I will write a synopsis of the diagnostic and repair protocol and keep it filed for any future unfortunates.

Oh and here is an example of how we CRD owners are being poked by DC for parts....a Bosch CP3 pump for a Duramax $750 same pump for us $3000. The only difference it the shaft/pulley configuration

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:30 pm

Robin and his merry men need to be seeing a 1/2 rack of Kokanee, Eh!

drharv · **Posted:** Thu Jun 21, 2007 3:42 pm

It was towed out of my garage about 20 minutes ago to one of two certified CRD/Sprinter techs in Alberta. The Service Manager and tech have heard the sordid details and are very sympathetic, if not abit pissed at the other dealer. They want to prove their mettle and fix this beast in a timely fashion/as inexpensively as possible. Funny, as of noon today I still have no restrictions on my warranty. I fully expect to pay for the diagnostic and repair time necessary to put this back on the road. BUT there is an minute chance that they may be able to warranty the thing. The tech will start fresh and run the tests necessary; he has no confidence in the town dealer's diagnostic skills.

Good news..I bought a pump for the low price of $2100 and it is to arrive next week. Thanks for all of the encouragement and advice, I will update when it lives.

MIKEY

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Thu Jun 21, 2007 3:53 pm

Good news Mikey. Can we ask how the other certified mechanics got involved? Did you contact them or did the word just get around?

drharv · **Posted:** Thu Jun 21, 2007 4:42 pm

We called every dealership in Calgary and area, most of the service guys/gals were up front on their knowledge of the products. We sent it to the one with the best story....let's hope it is true. Oh and mrsdrharv sent a couple of dozen cookies with the Jeep as a small, albeit very tasty, bribe.

LanduytG · **Joined:** Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:59 am **Posts:** 188

Any word yet?

Greg

drharv · **Posted:** Mon Jun 25, 2007 4:28 pm

The qualified tech is trying to diagnose it today. I have ordered a fuel injection pump so it will be here IF that is the problem. A giant frustrating cluster is what this situation is; I will know more later today or early tomorrow.

skywarn · **Posted:** Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:37 am

well?????

the suspense is killing me!!!

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:39 am

skywarn wrote:

well?????

the suspense is killing me!!!

x2

erockskj · **Posted:** Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:52 am

Mine`s @ the dealersh@! with same mystery problem.
Everyones waiting with baited breath for the cure.
I will post as soon as I know something.
Erock

drharv · **Posted:** Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:02 pm

The shop looked at the beast for 2 hours yesterday and all things are still pointing to a failed pump, yet they are still looking at sensors. The pump has been paid for and is ready to be picked up and dropped off at the dealership in case they need it. Note: I was able to get the pump for about $1000 cheaper than mopar sells it here in Canadialand through a friend who is a parts man at our local Audi dealership.

I will be speaking with the service manager and the tech about what tests have been run, their results, and what they could do next if they are not 100% sure it is the pump. If they answer my slightly educated questions appropriately, then I will have them install the pump. I have done many major repairs on many vehicles but this pump removal and installation is very difficult, if not impossible, without proprietary tools. Rest assured that if there is no other choice but to replace the Teutonic piece of dung, the failed pump will be sent for an autopsy to the qualified wizard by the name of Robin Hood (I kid you not). He seems to be interested in the result of this fiasco as much as the rest of us.

The service manager has said that he will go to bat for me to reinstate the full warranty once the repairs are made. He has done such for other owners in the past with positive results. Yet another reason to have the work performed by a MOPAR tech.

I will know much more this afternoon and will update accordingly. Truly, this is such a gong show that I just want the thing to run again.

Eric, I hope they can figure out what is up with yours soon.

DC is denying warranty on the injection pump due to CAT2!!!

Who is online