The New Fuel Filter, Filter Head, Lift Pump Thread

o8k · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:11 pm

Just replaced the whole thing w/ another one from mopar

1) the plug on the right is melted and dmged and needs replacing, Im driving around w/ it unpluged, is that the heater coil power er what (hence its melted and cracked the whole upper assembly)? I live in AZ where it gets down to 84 at night and up to 115 in the day. If it is the heater coil i prolly have a while till i need to find another plug.

2) Is there a fuel filter cargerage inside the silver metal can that i need to add or does the mopar asembly come w/ all that?

3) Thought, why not pay the extra money every time you swap out your fuel filter and just do the whole assembly, so u never have to worry about the thing going bad on you?

o8k

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 1:56 pm

o8k wrote:

Just replaced the whole thing w/ another one from mopar

1) the plug on the right is melted and dmged and needs replacing, Im driving around w/ it unpluged, is that the heater coil power er what (hence its melted and cracked the whole upper assembly)? I live in AZ where it gets down to 84 at night and up to 115 in the day. If it is the heater coil i prolly have a while till i need to find another plug.

2) Is there a fuel filter cargerage inside the silver metal can that i need to add or does the mopar asembly come w/ all that?

3) Thought, why not pay the extra money every time you swap out your fuel filter and just do the whole assembly, so u never have to worry about the thing going bad on you?

o8k

Besure to file a report with the NHTSA :idea:

bbertram · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2005 4:17 pm **Posts:** 144

BankNote4X4 wrote:

Speaking of reinventing,

1. bbertram, did the loctite treatment prove successful?

Thanks,
Josh

So far so good. No problems, no stalls.

dgeist · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 5:30 pm

Cowcatcher wrote:

I don't know that we have yet determined if the Euro version uses a different head today. We may only have pictures from the earlier 2.5 version which used this seemingly standard RACOR filter head. This filter is available for between $100 and $200 depending on which model, filtration and if you order a heater or not.

For that matter, have any of the aussies chimed in here? I'd be interested in what's on the CRDs down under as they don't seem to have the same kinds of problems as we do in the states... (perhaps it spins in the opposite direction....)

Dan

Threeweight · **Joined:** Mon May 14, 2007 5:57 pm **Posts:** 679

Does anyone know what filter head/filter the Grand Cherokee CRD comes equiped with?

o8k · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:55 pm

o8k wrote:

Just replaced the whole thing w/ another one from mopar

1) the plug on the right is melted and dmged and needs replacing, Im driving around w/ it unpluged, is that the heater coil power er what (hence its melted and cracked the whole upper assembly)? I live in AZ where it gets down to 84 at night and up to 115 in the day. If it is the heater coil i prolly have a while till i need to find another plug.

2) Is there a fuel filter cargerage inside the silver metal can that i need to add or does the mopar asembly come w/ all that?

3) Thought, why not pay the extra money every time you swap out your fuel filter and just do the whole assembly, so u never have to worry about the thing going bad on you?

o8k

Could someone please answer question #1 and #2 here im dieing to know =)

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:03 pm

1) In your neck of the woods I would leave it unplugged. Just don't drive nort in the winter!
2) The silver thing is the whole filter.

MACKJ · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:09 pm

dgeist wrote:

Cowcatcher wrote:

I don't know that we have yet determined if the Euro version uses a different head today. We may only have pictures from the earlier 2.5 version which used this seemingly standard RACOR filter head. This filter is available for between $100 and $200 depending on which model, filtration and if you order a heater or not.

For that matter, have any of the aussies chimed in here? I'd be interested in what's on the CRDs down under as they don't seem to have the same kinds of problems as we do in the states... (perhaps it spins in the opposite direction....)

Dan

No Dan we all spin in the same direction on this one.
The 2.8 CRD's in Oz have exactly the same setup, the only difference between the US and Oz model is that the steering wheel is on the right (correct) side of the car. :wink:

I have battled with air leaks for some time now and it is coming from the O ring between the head top and the "puck".
This why in my earlier post I suggested to bbertram to try loctite because this is where I am heading to hopefully solve the air leak problem. I haven't had it stall on me yet but when it runs like crap I bleed the air and all is OK for a while.
I haven't heard of any guys in Oz burning out the heating element though.

o8k · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 8:53 pm

Cowcatcher wrote:

1) In your neck of the woods I would leave it unplugged. Just don't drive nort in the winter!
2) The silver thing is the whole filter.

Wonderful! Good to know i didnt make any ill assumptions =)

dgeist · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:37 pm

MACKJ wrote:

I have battled with air leaks for some time now and it is coming from the O ring between the head top and the "puck".
This why in my earlier post I suggested to bbertram to try loctite because this is where I am heading to hopefully solve the air leak problem. I haven't had it stall on me yet but when it runs like crap I bleed the air and all is OK for a while.
I haven't heard of any guys in Oz burning out the heating element though.

I'm using the factory filter gasket between my head and puck (with the CAT2 conversion) and I seem to get a tiny bit of leakage about once a month, but not so much since I tried the "nail the pedal for 10 seconds" trick. That seems to have slowed things a bit.

I think the heating element problem was with folks that had air bubbles (no thermal conductance around the element) AND were in colder climates where the element was actually coming on. AU weather does tend to be more temperate than the US/Canada in the winter, no? If I remember correctly, unless the temp drops below about 50F, it doesn't even come on.

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:05 pm

dgeist wrote:

If I remember correctly, unless the temp drops below about 50F, it doesn't even come on.

It's a self regulating heater who's internal resistance changes with the fuel temperature. It's powered anytime the engine is running. As I recall the temperature it shut's it's self off at is 85 degrees.

MACKJ · **Posted:** Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:17 pm

dgeist wrote:

... AU weather does tend to be more temperate than the US/Canada in the winter, no? If I remember correctly, unless the temp drops below about 50F, it doesn't even come on...

Not quite correct. I live in an area of Oz that is considered to be "temperate". We are in the middle of winter here and the daily temps have been consistently in the range from 4C (39F) to 15C(60F), sometimes dropping to 1C (33F) overnight. Yes, not as cold as some in the US but probably cold enough to keep the fuel heater on.

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:37 am

MACKJ wrote:

dgeist wrote:

... AU weather does tend to be more temperate than the US/Canada in the winter, no? If I remember correctly, unless the temp drops below about 50F, it doesn't even come on...

Not quite correct. I live in an area of Oz that is considered to be "temperate". We are in the middle of winter here and the daily temps have been consistently in the range from 4C (39F) to 15C(60F), sometimes dropping to 1C (33F) overnight. Yes, not as cold as some in the US but probably cold enough to keep the fuel heater on.

Yup and if you read up a few posts o8k's melted in AZ.

So with the vote from OZ it seems that the RACOR was a 2.5 Liter CRD part that either changed with the 2.8 or with 2005 models. RACOR never replied to my inquiry about that filter by the way so one might question their customer service.

bbertram · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2005 4:17 pm **Posts:** 144

I'm wondering if you can put the Loctite Gasket sealent around the outside of the puck to prevent leaks? I put it inside and out and so far not one stall or problem.

retmil46 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 11:01 am

Ranger1 had his melt TWICE, here in NC. He believes that part of the problem, besides air, is the size of the contact pins on the electrical connector. A bad connection on those pins increases resistance and generates heat. On his, the connector on the wiring harness actually melted.

One thing to note - if you have the ignition in the RUN position, there is constant power applied to the heater. If you're sitting in the vehicle parked for any length of time with the engine off and want to listen to the radio, use the ACC position (turn the top of the key toward you).

The heater doesn't have an on/off type thermostat on it. It's made out of what's called a Positive Temperature Coefficient (PTC) material. As it's temperature goes up, it's electrical resistance goes up to the point that it effectively shuts itself off, but still has power applied to it. If the heater element develops a defect such that the electrical resistance doesn't go up sufficiently, you can end up with a runaway condition.

Basically, there is no shutoff or safety shutdown feature on the fuel heater while the key is in the RUN position other than the 20 amp fuse in the power distribution panel.

A simple on/off thermostat included in the circuit could have saved us, and with a potential recall DC as well, a lot of grief.

retmil46 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 11:32 am

I called a couple of local diesel equipment suppliers the other day, getting an idea on pricing of replacement Racor/Stanadyne fuel filter units, and on a Racor spin-on filter with heated bowl that would fit on the factory filter head.

While talking with one gent from a company in Greensboro, while in the middle of looking up the different options for a filter assembly, he stopped and said "Mind if I ask you a question?"

I said "Go ahead."

He asked "Why do you need a fuel heater here in NC? From our experience, with the normal temps we see in this area, as long as you're using an appropriate fuel treatment you shouldn't have any need of a fuel heater."

:shock:

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:21 pm

retmil46 wrote:

Ranger1 had his melt TWICE, here in NC. He believes that part of the problem, besides air, is the size of the contact pins on the electrical connector. A bad connection on those pins increases resistance and generates heat. On his, the connector on the wiring harness actually melted.

Did the connection melt and cause a leak because of resistance or did the connection leak causing resistance? Chicken/Egg! Egg/Chicken?

retmil46 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:17 pm

Cowcatcher wrote:

retmil46 wrote:

Ranger1 had his melt TWICE, here in NC. He believes that part of the problem, besides air, is the size of the contact pins on the electrical connector. A bad connection on those pins increases resistance and generates heat. On his, the connector on the wiring harness actually melted.

Did the connection melt and cause a leak because of resistance or did the connection leak causing resistance? Chicken/Egg! Egg/Chicken?

Don't know on that one. Would have to talk to Ranger1 and get his input on all the circumstances.

BTW, Kennedy lift pump is now installed and operational, along with fuel line insulation sleeving installed. When I get the chance, I'll crawl underneath and get pics, then send your way so everyone can get a look.

tigafila · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:38 pm

I installed a Racor 245 on Sunday and it has already surpassed the stock unit's time between stalling or no-starts!! Time will tell if there is any air being sucked in at the quick connects by the tank, I'll report more as time goes on. Tigafila

Cowcatcher · **Posted:** Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:52 pm

tigafila wrote:

I installed a Racor 245 on Sunday and it has already surpassed the stock unit's time between stalling or no-starts!! Time will tell if there is any air being sucked in at the quick connects by the tank, I'll report more as time goes on. Tigafila

Did you deal with WIF, Temp and heater? How? Pics?

Thanks for being a pioneer.

The New Fuel Filter, Filter Head, Lift Pump Thread

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