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PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 12:27 pm 
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chrispitude wrote:
I seem to have created quite a stir on the RV.net forum:

link to RV.net thread

- Chris

They talk out of ignorance. I got the same thing on my SVO message board when I posted a picture of my CRD pulling my SVO on an 18ft trailer. MOst guys are taken back by the fact that this small SUV can SAFELY tow the same as their 1/2 pickups and get double the mileage while doing so....

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 12:45 pm 
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Location: Saylorsburg, PA
RTStabler51 wrote:
They talk out of ignorance. I got the same thing on my SVO message board when I posted a picture of my CRD pulling my SVO on an 18ft trailer. MOst guys are taken back by the fact that this small SUV can SAFELY tow the same as their 1/2 pickups and get double the mileage while doing so....


It was interesting when one person called the CRD a "narrow top-heavy SUV" prone to tipping over. Most of the CRD's weight is either over the steering axle (engine) or down very low (4WD drivetrain). I have a 2005 Toyota Tundra 4WD with an 8ft bed, and the CRD is heavier than my truck.

- Chris


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:46 pm 
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Location: Saylorsburg, PA
(Much of this post comes from a similar post on the RV.net forums.)

Hi all,

We just returned from our second camping trip, a three day weekend venture up to Hills Creek State Park in PA. We had the Inmotion tune performed on our Jeep Liberty CRD which adds a claimed 35hp and 45ft-lb. I can't vouch for the exact gains, but the tune accomplished its goal of helping give a little more oomph up the hills. For steep grades where I had to fall back to 3rd (locked) before and was still still slowly losing speed, I could now pull them in 4th (locked) and maintain speed or even accelerate slightly. When locked in 3rd with the tune, I was able to pull every grade on this trip.

One grade was fairly mild but several miles long. I took the grade in 4th gear (locked up) at 55mph, which is 1750rpm. After the first mile, the temperature gauge started to climb. By the end of the grade, the needle was one tick below 3/4. This seems hot, but my fellow Jeep forum members have scan gauges which read the actual coolant temperature from the computer and they found that 3/4 on the gauge is still a reasonable operating temperature. I'll try to get an idea of exactly what temperature this needle position indicates.

Running hotter is an expected side effect of the Inmotion tune. In the front end, the layering is:

  • A/C condenser (top half), transmission cooler (bottom half)
  • intercooler
  • radiator


Basically, the radiator is on the losing end of the deal. With the higher boost pressures, the intercooler and engine both generate more heat, and the engine runs hotter under heavy sustained loads. The solution is to replace the restrictive factory muffler with a high-flow aftermarket muffler. The factory exhaust system is shared betweeh tne 2.4L 4-cyl gasser, the 3.7L 6-cyl gasser, and the 2.8L 4-cyl diesel. It's just not up to handling the flow of the boosted 2.8L. With the exhaust opened up, the exhaust gas temperatures are significantly reduced and the engine operates cooler (and makes a bit more power as a bonus).

I have a Magnaflow cat-back exhaust system on order. It's stainless steel and mandrel-bent 2.5" pipe, and will be a nice complement to the Inmotion tune. Reports indicate that it sounds identical to stock at cruise, and the turbocharger whine is just a hair louder when you stomp the go pedal. I'm a fan of quiet exhaust systems, so this is a nice upgrade for me. The stainless steel will also be a welcome upgrade for the Northeast daily driver salt duty that this vehicle will get.

I am also looking into adding an additional transmission cooler before the factory cooler in the nose. I am friends with the owner of a local transmission shop, and he does excellent work at great prices. He loves the CRD, and after getting a taste of what it can do with the Suncoast install, is eager to further upgrade it.

Once we got near the state park, the roads were unpaved. At a stop sign going up a steep hill, the rear wheels threw a lot of stones at the trailer and I struggled to get traction. I put the transfer case into 4WD part-time which locks the center diff, and was able to pull the trailer right up the hill from a stop. I could have used 4WD full-time (works on paved roads too) but the transfer case operates with an open differential in that mode, and I figured that it was less stress on the transfer case to keep it locked when pulling a heavy load up a loose stone road.

Once we got to the park and got to our site, the short wheelbase of the Jeep again paid off in spades. Our site was level, but the road going by it was a steep, narrow uphill. I was able to throw the trailer into a tight bend backing up (wasn't too far off from 90 degrees), then swing the nose around and "catch back up" to straighten out. It really made my trailer backing-up skills look better than they really are. I would have been hours of entertainment for my fellow RVers in a pickup truck.

I got a little ahead of myself unhitching, and didn't follow the correct sequence of steps to unhitch the Hensley. I managed to catch the safety breakaway cable and pull it off, and I also forgot to take the tension off the weight distribution bars before pulling the Hensley stinger out of the hitch head. I can now appreciate the value of having handy checklists. I don't care to do that again. I'll need to replace my breakaway brake cable before our next trip.

On the trip there, we went 271.2 miles on 16.9 gallons of diesel. That's 16mpg, but part of that tank (about 90 miles) was unhitched, and part of that was in 4WD full-time exploring back roads near the Grand Canyon of Pennsylvania. On the trip back, we traveled 180.2 miles on 11.4 gallons. That's 15.8mpg, and only about 10 miles of that tank was unhitched. I'm pretty happy with those numbers. For the second half of the trip back, we put the windows up and turned on the A/C. That may have actually helped our mileage. I kept an eye on the temperature with the air conditioning on, but it did just fine. It was about 85F outside.

I stopped at a CAT scale on the way back to weigh in our traveling configuration. First I pulled the Jeep on the scale and unhitched the TT. The weights were:

STEER AXLE 2400 lb
DRIVE AXLE 2080 lb
TRAILER AXLE 5020 lb
GROSS WEIGHT 9500 lb

These weights were without my wife and I in the Jeep but with both dogs loaded. I realized this too late once I stood on my tiptoes to reach the call button. As you can see, most of the weight in this little beast is over the steering axle even without the front seat occupants. It was also nice to see that even with my wife and I added in, we were still under the GCVW rating of the CRD (just a smidge over 10k, will grab the manual later and edit).

To measure these weights, I had to unhitch the Hensley on the scale. While I was hitching up, a trucker came over to me and said, "Hey fella, just so you know, you're holding up a hundred thousand dollars of load, okay?" Even with hitching up straight back, it took me a few tries under pressure to line it up right. Doh, that was fun.

Once hitched up, I set the weight distribution where I normally kept it, drove back around on the scale, and reweighed (only $1!):

STEER AXLE 2460 lb (+60)
DRIVE AXLE 2640 lb (+560)
TRAILER AXLE 4400 lb (-640)
GROSS WEIGHT 9500 lb (+20)

I originally set my weight bars by ride feel and by eye, but I was hesitant with the unibody to err on the aggressive side without being able to actually measure the weight distribution. As you can see, I was way too timid with the weight bars! The transferred tongue weight isn't too far over the 500lb U.S. rating. I turned each weight bar adjustment nut four full turns, drove around the scale again, and reweighed (another buck!):

STEER AXLE 2520 lb (+120)
DRIVE AXLE 2580 lb (+500)
TRAILER AXLE 4400 lb (-640)
GROSS WEIGHT 9500 lb (+20)

Better, but still nowhere near enough. I pulled off the scale and found I was able to only get three more turns on the adjustment nut before I hit the stop. It looks like I'll need to bring the coarse adjustment pin up one hole to get some more adjustment range, but I wasn't too keen on doing this without talking to Hensley first. I asked the scale operator when the scales weren't busy, and he said between 10pm and 6am when most drivers are sleeping. I'll repeat the experiment another time and get it set up better. Even with the modest additional amount of weight transferred to the front, my wife and I both agreed the ride and stability was noticeably better. With the proper distribution, I think it will feel a lot better than it does now. The new Pirelli Scorpion ATR load range D tires should also help improve ride stability. It's good timing too, as the current Firestone Destination A/Ts don't have a whole lot of tread left.

While we were unhitched at the campsite, I recalled what Andy Thomson (on RV.net) mentioned about play in the receiver. I put the Hensley stinger in the Jeep receiver, and sure enough there was some side-to-side play of the 2" stinger bar in the receiver opening! It's maybe 3/16" of movement at the far end of the stinger bar, but it's still a source of play. A very slight bit of extra width on the stinger bar would lessen this play. Is there an easy way to accomplish this? I was thinking of something along the lines of a coat of epoxy paint on both sides, or maybe a strip of some sort of very thin plastic adhered to both sides. I read a post on the RV.net forums about welding a bead along the side of the 2" bar and grinding it down to add a bit of width and reduce hitch play (not Hensley specific), but this seems a little more labor intensive than a couple coats of epoxy paint. Any ideas?

- Chris


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:33 am 
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Hi all,

To get ready for this camping season, I brought my weight bars up one notch and went back to the CAT scales yesterday. First, just the CRD by itself is:

STEER AXLE 2400 lb
DRIVE AXLE 1980 lb
TRAILER AXLE 0 lb
GROSS WEIGHT 4380 lb

This was with no occupants and a full tank of fuel. After that, we hitched up and weighed to see how much trailer weight was transferred to the CRD's axles. Each reweigh was $1. This time my wife and I used walkie-talkies. She'd radio me in the incremental transfer to each axle from the weight desk, and I'd adjust the bars out on the scale. Here's how it weighed the way it was configured for the drive to the scale:

STEER AXLE 2420 lb (+20)
DRIVE AXLE 2600 lb (+620)
TRAILER AXLE 4320 lb (-640)
GROSS WEIGHT 9340 lb

No wonder it didn't feel very sure-footed. It was okay on flat road but bump roads did not feel stable. On the fourth weigh (third hitched weigh), we got it:

STEER AXLE 2680 lb (+280)
DRIVE AXLE 2280 lb (+300)
TRAILER AXLE 4380 lb (-580)
GROSS WEIGHT 9340 lb

From the numbers, we can see the static trailer weight is 4960 and we got nearly perfect weight transfer. This was also our first tow with the Pirelli Scorpion ATR load range D tires, aired up to about 50psi. With the adjusted bars, the tire sidewalls still squatted a bit and I'll probably try 60psi next time. It felt a world of difference better on the trip back home. Other than pulling the weight, it was easy to forget it was back there even on a bumpy highway.

- Chris

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Suncoast TC, Transgo shift kit, Inmotion, ORM, EHM, Magnaflow SS exhaust, Fumoto valve, EVIC added, Hensley TruControl brake controller, Pirelli Scorpion ATR LR-D in spring/summer/fall, FIA winter front and Blizzaks in winter


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:27 pm 
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Location: Cochrane Alberta
Well done Chris!
I also tow a TT with the CRD. Mine is only 21' but it still makes people wonder. I also went with an ultralight (Trail Cruiser 21RBH) and I tow it exlusively i the rockies. It tows like a train and can keep up with almost any other TT in the mountains. i agree that most people are using their eyes not their brains when they see us a comin' with the wee tractor and big trailer. My brother has a Dodge 3500 CTD and a huge heavy double slide TT and he gets about 8 mpg while towing. The worst I ever got was 14 mpg with a 50 mph headwind. My temps never climb more than a touch over normal and only on long slow grades in the summer. I also purchased true LTR tires and air them up to about 50 while towing; it sure makes a difference.

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New Injector Pump
New ECU
New MAF, MAP, Crank and Cam sensors
New Fuel filter head/heater and wiring harness (x2)
New Glow Plug Control Module and wires to it
New EVIC (Only thing on this list covered by warranty)
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:32 pm 
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I added fuel to the fire.

Wierd they banned the word crap on there.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:16 pm 
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LOL this is great.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:17 pm 
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I asked on that forum before getting the CRD and a new Sunline 1950 TT. One of the moderators thought it would be a good combo. He was right. We pulled the trailer from Michigan to Oregon through snow, high winds, and with lots of screaming semis trying to blow us off the road. The only problems we had were due to failure to RTFM for the Hensley. We lucked out on the Hensley: $800 on Craigslist. We did stop at Hensley's office to pick up their towing mirrors and spare parts kit. For a place that sells very high price equipment, they certainly didn't invest in posh quarters, or even a receptionist. You just have to open unmarked doors to pry a salesman out.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:12 am 
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CATCRD wrote:
Don't waste money on the aeroturbine. Way overpriced for having nothing inside it but a perforated pipe. Their power claims are bogus. Just get a glasspack if you want a straight-through system.


The areoturbine made a noticeable improvement on my Dodge Cummins. The guys who are running them in their Liberty CRD seem to like them as well.

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