Mesa Ranger District Closures....

AZKJ · **Posted:** Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:20 pm

Some food for thought. I took this from another group I belong to...

"What the heck happened to our message board? Has the Nations economic problems got you down? Maybe it is the rising unemployment rate, the rising foreclosure rate or our newly elected president?

I am privy to some information that will get the talk going again.

The gate at Butcher Jones will soon be permanently closed. Not to be misunderstood I will repeat, PERMANENTLY CLOSED. The only access the Rolls/Coves area will be at the Pobricito Staging area just north of the Butcher Jones turnoff, but as I write this the tube fence is being built there. The entire Rolls area will soon be locked down with permit access required, just like Bulldog Canyon. I know this because I have been involved in an organization called TRAL (Tonto Recreation Alliance) This non-profit organization meets with Tonto Forest officials once a month to discuss ways to help preserve our off highway use in the Tonto. This new organization is local to the Mesa Ranger District for now. It will be expanding to the Cave Creek District after the Mesa District gets a little more established, and then further north. I have volunteered our group to "Adopt part of a Trail" in the Bulldog area. More information on that to follow in the upcoming months. Some more news on the subject of gated areas. The Lower Sycamore Creek area (Widowmaker) will soon have a new entrance at the newly constructed overpass at the intersection of Bush Hwy and Beeline Hwy. Where Bush Hwy meets the Beeline you will go over the overpass and continue on into the Lower Sycamore area, and I believe I failed to mention, there will be a locked gate there also! Four Peaks and Upper Sycamore roads will also be gated and locked. There is more at stake here than just the 4X4, ATV, UTV and motorcycle users. You have the commercial users like the Hummer, Jeep and ATV tours. They have to have permits to run specific trails in these Tonto Forest areas. I got involved with this group at the request of Desert Dog Hummer tours which some of you know I drive tours for. This is not going to happen overnight but the Rolls/Coves area is high on the list and is being worked on as we speak. It is not new to anyone who uses that area that the drunken kids tear the area up, cut new trails and leave their beer cans and trash all over the place. This is the same reason that they gated and locked Bulldog 20 years ago. For the most part the forest service feels that the Bulldog program has worked, not perfectly, but it did cut down on misuse in the area and they are hoping that gating these additional areas will do the same. If anyone would like to attend one of these meetings with me they are on the first Tuesday evening of every month, the next one being April 7th at 6:30. The meeting place is at the Mesa Ranger District office, the same place where you get your Bulldog permits. If you have any questions feel free to contact me. I think this post might create a little talk on the message board."

And my response...

"Geez... that's pretty drastic to start locking everyone out that doesn't have a permit like the one you need for Bulldog Canyon. Yet on the other hand, maybe that's what is needed to preserve our lands. If you have ever been involved in clean-ups in the Rolls or the Four Peaks areas, you know what i mean. No sooner than an area gets cleaned up, it's trashed again (last months Four Peaks Clean-up is a perfect example).

If they have had good luck with the Bulldog Canyon area, then I say go for it. The one downside would be the Coves... boaters are responsible for trashing that area as well as four wheeling rednecks and kids out partying. I'd hate to see permits required for our public lands, but if that's what it takes, people have brought it upon themselfs and no amount of clean-ups would keep the area from getting continuously trashed. Who knows, the areas might one day turn into fee areas, or even worse... someday closed to all vehicle traffic. I'd rather have locked gates with a permit required for access than have everything closed off.

AJ"

corwyyn · **Posted:** Thu Mar 12, 2009 7:19 pm

I knew the Butcher Jones gate was eventually going to be closed, didn't realize it was going to be this soon. Also knew they had plans for Sycamore Creek but again didn't know an exact time frame.

It is unfortunate that there are individuals who have no regard for our public lands and force the FS and others to take these steps, but after seeing all of the threads on one of the local forums about recovering abandoned/torched vehicles from that area I understand the necessity And yes I agree that as far as the coves are concerned boaters play just as much a role (if not more) in how they are misused, but it is next to impossible to convince someone with too much alcohol in them of that.

Silverdiesel · **Posted:** Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:16 pm

Oh wow--
I have been living here in Arizona and rasing a family here for almost 30 years and we have all this wonderfull wilderness so close by and available to us. Unfortunately being a major metro area it is available to yahoos too.
Gating and requiring paid permits is about the only way to keep these lands for the benefit of people who really deserve them and will not trash them out.
Some people cry foul cause of inconvience and $$ but nowadays nothing is "Free". You know it even takes fuel to power your vehicle to these formerly "free" places and I do not get diesel for free just to get to NFS/State Trust/BLM lands. So now I agree its fenced off areas and "Pay up" for a permit.
If this is the only way to stop those mentioned yahoos- so be it.
( But please don't close them to everyone!!)

Roland

AZKJ · **Posted:** Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:39 pm

Roland... I feel the same way. The only thing I dislike is you have to go to the Mesa Ranger's Office to get the permit in person. They won't do it by mail. So for people not living close by, it would be a real hassle. The same goes for the other Ranger Districts. It would be nuts to have to go to each of them for the different permits. They would have to do like they do for State Trust Lands... by mail and charge a fee.

Speaking of fees... have you seen what they've raised the fee for a State Land Permit to??? And from what I've been hearing, they have increased patrolling the different areas to enforce the fee requirement. There is a big fine to be out there without a permit. When I was out at Bulldog Canyon last month, we ran into "two" rangers. One even told me to get my one tire was off the trail. It was in a little patch of scrub while we were parked. He said he could of given me a ticket for that!!

Taken from the State Land website...

"Recreational permits are available for an individual ($50), or a family limited to two adults and children under the age of 14 ($75)."

It used to be $20.00 a year.

AJ

Silverdiesel · **Posted:** Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:50 pm

I read about that State Trust land fee increase last year - it is pretty pricey!

On the ATV side I understand now for 2009 on State Trust lands and NFS lands where ATV's are allowed a physical motorcycle type license plate showing title ownership and appropiate fee paid is now required. I have had my two bikes with installed plates since new in 2001. Now to use them I need to buy the fee stickers to put on said plates. Those fees are pricey too. I remember in the past talking to other ATVers asking why I had plates in the first place and they assumed I ran the units street legal. Most of these guys did not even have titles to their ATVs much less plates.

Mesa Ranger District Closures....

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