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 Post subject: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:19 am 
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Unedited, what more can I say?

"The K-series engine is prone to head gasket failure whatever car it is
installed in. The problem is worst in big, heavy cars like the
Freelander, but it happens in Elises and Sevens as well.

Light, compact and powerful as it might be, the design of this engine
is deeply flawed in several key areas. The design of the seal between
the top of the liners and the head/gasket places too much strain on
the gasket and causes premature failure. Not helped by the metal of
the liners expanding at a different rate to the surrounding block and
head.

The second problem is that the standard of casting on these engines is
crude, and varies dramatically. If you get a bad one it seems to pop
gaskets until you give up and chuck it in a skip. Others are better.
It's pot luck what you get.

The third problem is that the thermostat is placed on the return from
the radiator rather than the outlet. A ludicrous design which relies
on heat soak from the head side of the 'stat to "overcome" the cold
water in the radiator before the thermostat opens. This holds the
thermostat closed for too long, causing head temperatures to rise
excessively. When the thermostat does eventually open, this (too) hot
cylinder head is suddenly subjected to thermal shock from the cold
radiator water hitting it. It's a comically bad design.

The thermostats have also been observed to "bounce" several times
before they open. As soon as the cold water rushes through, it closes
the 'stat again, causing head temperatures to rise again. Repeat two
or three times for each engine warm up cycle. The only surprise of K-
series head gaskets is that they last as long as they do."

:-)r :-)r :-)r :-)r :-)r :-)r :-)r

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:56 am 
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I'm not sure what the "K" series engine is but if it's a VM product I can add that Jeep also used a VM diesel starting in the 92 XJ. I belong to a VM group and they there are plenty of head gasket problems to o around :pepper: Also there was a Ford product that used a VM diesel, Scorpio maybe.

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:32 am 
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Drove a Freelander in Europe. K series engines are gas not diesel. Freelanders used a KV6 gas engine and a Merdedes supplied Diesel engine.


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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:53 am 
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Speaking of crappy engine designs, let's not forget the diesel in the 300SDL, their "experiment" with aluminum heads. One hot day where the temperature exceeds the thermostat setting, you get head cracks.

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:24 pm 
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UFO wrote:
Speaking of crappy engine designs, let's not forget the diesel in the 300SDL, their "experiment" with aluminum heads. One hot day where the temperature exceeds the thermostat setting, you get head cracks.


My '86 had 250K miles on it with the original head when I sold it. There was a silent recall to replace the trap oxidizer, which could take out the turbo and cause major damage.

The stroked version of this engine used in the 350 SD/SDL had huge problems with egg shaped cylinders, bent rods, and heavy oil consumption.


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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:30 pm 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_K_engine

The Rover diesels are either MB or Ford "puma" sourced and both are supposedly quite good.... There's a reason you usually only hear about reliability issues with gasoline land rover products and the electronics systems that support them. Rover apparently doesn't know how to make gasoline EFI products, well not until Ford dropped their system into it a few years back. The diesels (with the possible exception of the TD5, which is apparently quirky) are rock solid when maintained properly.

Dan

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:05 pm 
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before K - Rover used a Buick 215 ci Aluminum v8 for ~30+ years
that was the one that GM canceled after the 61 Buick Special.............

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:31 am 
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:shock: wow, what a messed up design.....
:banghead:

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 3:07 am 
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Wobbly wrote:
UFO wrote:
Speaking of crappy engine designs, let's not forget the diesel in the 300SDL, their "experiment" with aluminum heads. One hot day where the temperature exceeds the thermostat setting, you get head cracks.


My '86 had 250K miles on it with the original head when I sold it. There was a silent recall to replace the trap oxidizer, which could take out the turbo and cause major damage.

The stroked version of this engine used in the 350 SD/SDL had huge problems with egg shaped cylinders, bent rods, and heavy oil consumption.


My 87 300SDL had 240k. Ran just fine. Miss it.

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 4:44 pm 
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Sir Sam wrote:
My 87 300SDL had 240k. Ran just fine. Miss it.
All the issues associated with the aluminum head rose arose on thermostat failures or slightly overheated conditions, or so I read on the Mercedes Shop forum. Maybe the reason that engine is poorly regarded is because the OM617 is so bulletproof. You can run that thing over 250F and never even know the difference.

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:50 pm 
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ATXKJ wrote:
before K - Rover used a Buick 215 ci Aluminum v8 for ~30+ years
that was the one that GM canceled after the 61 Buick Special.............


I'm most likely wrong but didn't Buick use the same engine in a V6 version up though the 80's?(Grand National)


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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:03 pm 
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Crankworm wrote:
ATXKJ wrote:
before K - Rover used a Buick 215 ci Aluminum v8 for ~30+ years
that was the one that GM canceled after the 61 Buick Special.............

I'm most likely wrong but didn't Buick use the same engine in a V6 version up though the 80's?(Grand National)


because the GN 3.8L was an Iron V6 I though it was different - but Wiki says you're right
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_V6_engine

it's also the V6 they sold to Jeep -

so as an Iron 3.8L V6 the design worked great - as an Aluminum 3.5L V8 it didn't....

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 Post subject: Re: Thouught we had problems look at the Landrover K engine
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:22 pm 
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Domestic, Import they all got problems, I think a bunch of loyalists to a big name auto maker that starts with a T just got a good slap in the face. I will say no more.

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