overheating????

OldSkull · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:55 pm

Hey Joe take a good look at the pic I post, you can see I forgot the iron wire I use to pull this "Thing" on shore! That's what I call "OldSkull GDE torque tune" :-)r

OldSkull · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:00 pm

kapalczynski wrote:

I actually just got large washers from lowes and machined the inside of them out on my lathe. Maybe I can order in a few washers and ship them out to anyone needing one. shouldn't cost much.
- Mark

Mark I need to know the spec of your fan! Mine is 2.25 thin , I see some 1.5" thin and I need to know how you install it, have you remove the alternator?

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:05 pm

OldSkull wrote:

Just back from another 1100Km in Gaspésie (Appalaches, Pointe-au-Père)trip with my camping trailer in the worse condition AKA slow traffic, powerful headwind, long period uphill ,my trans lockup in 4th gear for 1h 15 min because of the GDE ECO "torque" tune instead of constantly changing between 3th and 4th gear. The truck never overheats (cool air draft coming from the Saint-Laurent help a lot) and I didn’t replace my clutch fan yet but I take a look today and find out I need special tool to do the job and the fan I pick have 2 ¼” deep blades. I not sure this one fit there without some trimming…I need the exact spec for the Imperial 223619 Kapalczynski use to compare and a way to install this fan without cutting in the shroud….

PS: I get 19mpg carrying 3000pds in the worse condition and I didn’t drive like an old granny!

glad you found a washer substitute.

For removal: you have to completely unbolt the shroud and unblot the fan/fanclutch and pull them up together. I did not need to modify my shroud at all. You will need a large crescent wrench to remove the original fan/clutch. I followed GDE's instructions exactly...large adjustable wrench on the bolt, hit with hammer...or something like that (not an exact quote).

For installation: Easyiest to install the fan on the adapter first with the 4 bolts, 4 lock washers, 4 nuts (lock nuts if you have them work instead of lock washers). Then put the fan in shroud and slide them in together. Bolt fan shroud in place, place the 30mm washer(or washers depending on thickness) on the shaft and screw fan on the main bolt. The way the bolt is threaded is self tightening so you shouldn't have to worry about torque specs. That's it! You're done, and you'll never need another clutch or overheat again (unless your WP or thermostat goes out of course).

I will PM you my phone number in case you have questions. Same goes for all of you out there in the lost forum!

- Mark

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:06 pm

OldSkull wrote:

kapalczynski wrote:

I actually just got large washers from lowes and machined the inside of them out on my lathe. Maybe I can order in a few washers and ship them out to anyone needing one. shouldn't cost much.
- Mark

Mark I need to know the spec of your fan! Mine is 2.25 thin , I see some 1.5" thin and I need to know how you install it, have you remove the alternator?

do not need to remove the alternator...sending u my phone number now...check your PM's

I believe the part number I gave you should all be the exact same fan, no differences. Thats the one you need. The washer(s) is(are) for spacing it out a tiny bit
to ensure your fan doesn't hit any of your accessory drive stuff run by your drive belt.

What part number do you have?

- Mark

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:15 pm

I believe by my pics it looks like I used the 2 1/4 blades? hard to tell right now. I am in Alaska till sep 4th. Wish I could post pics from my phone...its beautiful up here. I'll be back home i 2 weeks, but by then I'm sure you will have it all installed and be enjoying it.

Heres what I used to remove fan clutch adn install new adapter:

http://www.harborfreight.com/15-inch-jumbo-adjustable-wrench-39619.html?utm_term=39619&utm_medium=cse&utm_source=googlebase

Pic:

It was $10.99 on sale from harbor freight tools.

- Mark

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:40 pm

The 223619 is all the same thickness. Just checked all the available websites I could fins that sold it. I think the thinner diameter fins is a different part number. You should be good.

Nice talking with you on the phone! Good luck getting that old fan clutch off!

Let us know how it goes,

- Mark

OldSkull · **Posted:** Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:19 pm

I finally disassemble the clutch fan and try to install the flex fan with the adapter and back spacer, my fan will hit the A/C compressor and using a back spacer leave not enough thread to screw the adapter secure so the solution is to use a front spacer, something like a 1" to get the fan at about 1.5" from the radiator and clear any hazardous situation. I order the part today and will post some pic soon.

No offence Mark but I’m skeptical about this mod, the original fan got 2” deep and only 5 short blades, I wonder if a 1.5” deep 6 blades can be up to the task and make less noise. Further testing need to done, I even consider trimming ¾ inch from each blade but before I need to know if the electric noisy fan will start less often with this big sucker running constantly behind the radiator.

UPDATE 31/08/2010: I have done my testing and my engine run to much cold, Winter season can be problematic and with this mod my Jeep sound like a garbage truck! No I don't know if cutting the blades could help.. It's just a 22 or 24 gauge stanless sheet so balance is not critical if you cut with precision...I just can't stand the noise and every folks at streets corners turning head to see what kind of "thing" made that noise...If I can find a hydraulic press I will remove some pitch on each blades and do futher testing but I'm still skeptical ....

Here the pic , you can see the fan, the 1" front spacer and the adapter assembled.

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Tue Sep 28, 2010 8:17 pm

OldSkull wrote:

I finally disassemble the clutch fan and try to install the flex fan with the adapter and back spacer, my fan will hit the A/C compressor and using a back spacer leave not enough thread to screw the adapter secure so the solution is to use a front spacer, something like a 1" to get the fan at about 1.5" from the radiator and clear any hazardous situation. I order the part today and will post some pic soon.

No offence Mark but I’m skeptical about this mod, the original fan got 2” deep and only 5 short blades, I wonder if a 1.5” deep 6 blades can be up to the task and make less noise. Further testing need to done, I even consider trimming ¾ inch from each blade but before I need to know if the electric noisy fan will start less often with this big sucker running constantly behind the radiator.

UPDATE 31/08/2010: I have done my testing and my engine run to much cold, Winter season can be problematic and with this mod my Jeep sound like a garbage truck! No I don't know if cutting the blades could help.. It's just a 22 or 24 gauge stanless sheet so balance is not critical if you cut with precision...I just can't stand the noise and every folks at streets corners turning head to see what kind of "thing" made that noise...If I can find a hydraulic press I will remove some pitch on each blades and do futher testing but I'm still skeptical ....

Here the pic , you can see the fan, the 1" front spacer and the adapter assembled.

The spacer should only need to be about 4mm thick and you should only lose 2 threads with the spacer. The adapter is STEEL and still has plenty of threads left. One could space the fan off the adapter to achieve more clearance, but then you would somehow have to ensure the fan is perfectly centered because if you space it away you move it away from the centered pin on the adapter that keeps it centered.

As for the noise, I did mention it was louder than stock, but it sounds good to me! lol The noise is just as loud as the factory fan with the clutch engaged. The noise is hardly noticeable to me, but but might be enough to annoy others. Personally I do not mind my Jeep sounding like it has power...it does.

If your temp is colder than the opening temp of 176 give or take 2 degrees probably for the partially opening of the tstat then your tstat is bad. You need to replace with a new unit. Use a scangauge to check exact temps. Run down the highway adn see what the cruising temp is. It should not be lower than about 174* F.

Good luck,

- Mark

Quiksilver · **Posted:** Wed Sep 29, 2010 3:38 am

toyota jeep man wrote:

she is spotless in there and i was thinking of putting the fixed flex fan on and i guess from the sound of it a new torque converter what is the most bad booty one i can put in it????

SunCoast TC

OldSkull · **Posted:** Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:09 am

Mark now I almost sure your fan don't have 2.25 inch pitch or the design is realy different. With a 3/8 spacer the blades of mine hit the A/C compressor! I need at least a half inch spacer to clear in the back! I have try to screw the adapter and it was impossible!

The front aluminium spacer is well design and can't be assembled off center! He insert like lego block between the adapter and the fan (2 metal parts) and It's secure with 4 Iron bolt and red locktite, it's realy "Moron proof"

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:49 am

OldSkull wrote:

Mark now I almost sure your fan don't have 2.25 inch pitch or the design is realy different. With a 3/8 spacer the blades of mine hit the A/C compressor! I need at least a half inch spacer to clear in the back! I have try to screw the adapter and it was impossible!

The front aluminium spacer is well design and can't be assembled off center! He insert like lego block between the adapter and the fan (2 metal parts) and It's secure with 4 Iron bolt and red locktite, it's realy "Moron proof"

Yes, I see now. I was picturing a shaft like aluminum piece. Your adapter in your pics looks high quality. (I could not see pics when I was on forum earlier they wouldn't load at work). I think the fan blades on yours definately come back further.

I have seen those spacers before. They have a nub on the end just like the original adapter. They will work good and will self align. It looks like you will just need a larger spacer and you will be good to go.

I STILL think your thermostat is bad since you said you were running around 160* F. I would try driving with factory fan and no trailer or load at 55mph (or ~90kph) or so and see if you still read a low temp with the high air flow of just hwy driving. If you still read lower than about half your thermostat is bad for sure.

The truck taking forever to warm up is a specific sign your thermostat is bad.

- Mark

*EDIT* I just measured my fan the blades have a 1-3/4" profile viewed from the side. I can definately see your problem with clearance. It is probably noisier than mine too which explains your complaints. Though I still think the sound is a nice powerful sound and you should just glare back if someone looks at you because you drive a POWERFUL jeep. ha ha :JEEPIN:

Unfortunately with the 2.25" pitch comes probably a little more economy loss than the imperial fan of 1.75". You will have more air flow though and thats not bad as long as you can deal with the noise and as long as your thermostat is good...based on what you said about running cool now I think you need to buy a new thermostat and you will be in top notch shape.

Quiksilver · **Posted:** Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:29 am

Forgive me if i'm being a fool... and please correct me if i'm wrong.

My understanding is that the theromstat controls the flow of coolant through the radiator. This coolant is what actually cools the engine.

The airflow generally speaking does very little to cool the engine directly (air cooling)

What is important is the airflow over the radiator, which is what keeps the coolant er cool. hence the FFF mod and the problem when the fan clutch is dead, not enough flow over the radiator at low speeds.

So, when the engine is cold the thermostat will not allow coolant to flow through the radiator. So even though with this mod the airflow will be higher at all times, the engine warm up time should be hardly effected.

But should assist greatly when the radiator is "open".

So, in summary if the engine is taking longer to warm up the thermostat is not dong its job and the flow of coolant is mostly likely on from get go or from a too low a temperature.

yes?

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:34 am

Quiksilver wrote:

Forgive me if i'm being a fool... and please correct me if i'm wrong.

My understanding is that the theromstat controls the flow of coolant through the radiator. This coolant is what actually cools the engine.

The airflow generally speaking does very little to cool the engine directly (air cooling)

What is important is the airflow over the radiator, which is what keeps the coolant er cool. hence the FFF mod and the problem when the fan clutch is dead, not enough flow over the radiator at low speeds.

So, when the engine is cold the thermostat will not allow coolant to flow through the radiator. So even though with this mod the airflow will be higher at all times, the engine warm up time should be hardly effected.

But should assist greatly when the radiator is "open".

So, in summary if the engine is taking longer to warm up the thermostat is not dong its job and the flow of coolant is mostly likely on from get go or from a too low a temperature.

yes?

Yeah sorry I edited my above post to make sense to viewers. I was explaining that on another thread to him and i accidentally got the 2 threads mixed up (http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=51618&start=120) he mentioned on that thread the fan was overcooling, i mentioned the thermostat controls that and it is probably stuck open to sum all that up]

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