Help need !!Broken glow plug ! What to do ?

racertracer · **Posted:** Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:06 pm

camo wrote:

a friend of mine with a Mercedes diesel only broke the thread of the GP and left it like that, about two weeks later the GP popped out due to the compression from the combustion chamber, it ripped the harness only but and a metallic part of the engine so it didn't cause further damage. however, he was stranded on the road and had to pay a wrecker to get back home. Still, a lot cheaper than removing the head.
:BANANA:

That's the way I see it.

But it took your friends mercedes a long time to push the plug out, I would think that the force of the compression in the cylinder would have ejected the plug sooner.

I would just let it the engine run in the driveway till it popped that baby out in a catch can filled with a thick 4" x 4" or whatever.

Although i would worry that it may strip the threads in the head as it shoots out. What do you think?

Sure beats drilling and tapping, and removeing the head.

Anybody ever hear of anyone removing a stuck Glow plug like this?

camo · **Posted:** Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:16 pm

racertracer wrote:

camo wrote:

a friend of mine with a Mercedes diesel only broke the thread of the GP and left it like that, about two weeks later the GP popped out due to the compression from the combustion chamber, it ripped the harness only but and a metallic part of the engine so it didn't cause further damage. however, he was stranded on the road and had to pay a wrecker to get back home. Still, a lot cheaper than removing the head.
:BANANA:

That's the way I see it.

But it took your friends mercedes a long time to push the plug out, I would think that the force of the compression in the cylinder would have ejected the plug out sooner.

I would just let it run in the driveway till it popped that baby out in a catch can filled with a thick 4" x 4".

I actualy tryed that out..... but gave up after 15 min of idle at 1200rpm!!!! the problem is that the carbon that siezes up the GP is like a hardened version of the soot from the egr so once it sits up there is like the GP had been glue to the head. But once the carbon gives way it comes out painlessly, when I felt the first pop when turning the nut at the extractor the GP came out the rest of the way by turning the nut via finger tips

racertracer · **Posted:** Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:24 pm

camo wrote:

racertracer wrote:

camo wrote:

a friend of mine with a Mercedes diesel only broke the thread of the GP and left it like that, about two weeks later the GP popped out due to the compression from the combustion chamber, it ripped the harness only but and a metallic part of the engine so it didn't cause further damage. however, he was stranded on the road and had to pay a wrecker to get back home. Still, a lot cheaper than removing the head.
:BANANA:

That's the way I see it.

But it took your friends mercedes a long time to push the plug out, I would think that the force of the compression in the cylinder would have ejected the plug out sooner.

I would just let it run in the driveway till it popped that baby out in a catch can filled with a thick 4" x 4".

I actualy tryed that out..... but gave up after 15 min of idle at 1200rpm!!!! the problem is that the carbon that siezes up the GP is like a hardened version of the soot from the egr so once it sits up there is like the GP had been glue to the head. But once the carbon gives way it comes out painlessly, when I felt the first pop when turning the nut at the extractor the GP came out the rest of the way by turning the nut via finger tips

What about filling the cavity with wd40 or some other penetrating lubricant and letting it sit overnight, and then try blowing it out in the morning?

Of Course the YouTube mechanics way of doing it maybe the correct way, but good ol Yankee Ingenuity maybe the simpler way.

camo · **Posted:** Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:43 pm

LOL.... sure, I put WD40 and let it settle for 2 days and didnt work, one think I forgot to mention was that it took me over a week geting that thing out, like 2 hours+ every day and even more on the weekends, the only thing I didnt try was pouring some water into the cylinder...... that really made me afraid.
the irony of all that work is that I might not even use the glow plugs down here in houston, other than 2 or 3 days a year.

alphred · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 8:51 am

I drive the vehicle at all from me for a test( for my turbo....http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=61315)I talked to a dealer who told me that I could bring him while driving.
So I drove very slowly, around the house....when I saw that everything was fine, I can give little more trottle.
Suddently I heard un loud pop and a whooshing. I stop de Jeep.
The friend who worked with me on the glow over said tip heater is gone !!!

I'm even more in troubles ?

Thanks

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 11:28 am

What is a tip heater?

alphred · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 12:07 pm

Sorry... The small end off the GP ( the element)

Wobbly · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:32 pm

Wild guesses:
1. glow plug tip stuck between valve and valve seat and allowed piston to contact valve.
Possible head, piston, and/or cylinder liner damage.

2. tip went through valve opening and hit turbo wheel, breaking off a piece and causing wheel imbalance and then turbo failure

3. other problem which is not due to glow plug tip.

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:06 pm

4. Glow plug tip was ejected out of the hole and problem solved.

alphred · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:16 pm

I hope it's number 4...lol...

How can i verify ?
A machanic told me that i can look inside with a little camera....it's a good way to do or i should make pull of the head ?

Wobbly... you think that the tip have more chance to be in the engine, than to have been ejected ?

The summer holidays arrive in a few weeks and i still in big trouble.

I have foud a good mechanic at a dealer but it's 110$ he worked regulary on Sprinter but i dont know if y add already do this job on a 2.8 crd....

:dizzy:

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:26 pm

Try to find the broken tip to see if the front part of it is still intact.

That would be evidence that the tip is either in the cylinder or not.

Look on the driveway, the engine compartment, remove the skid plate and see if the part is there.

alphred · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:18 pm

Thanks racertracer....it would be reassuring to find it .... :wink:

I steel have to take out the metalic part....

Wobbly · **Posted:** Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:59 pm

If the missing tip was stuck inside the metal shell when you attempted to remove the glow plug, then it might have been blown out through the glow plug hole out by compression. If it fell inside the cylinder, I don't think it's very likely that it could be blown out through the glow plug hole, unless the metal shell somehow was also blown out. The other possibilities are that the tip went through the valve openings, either in one piece, or that it deteriorated into small pieces, which went through the valve openings, or that it's still inside the cylinder.

alphred · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:35 am

A machinist came to my house to see if he could remove the plug blow before removing the head. Verdi, he does not want to risk it. This is the second person who refuses to do the work with the head on the Jeep. He also advised me to lift the motor head to be sage there is nothing in the engine. I asked two bids for the work, the first is $ 2300 Canadian, taxes included. In this amount there is a safety margin of $ 250 just in case. I should also add the reprogramming for new GP 5V.

1: I'm from Quebec, Canada, we were, we have temperatures between 20 and 30 degrees celcius. Can I roll the Jeep without connecting the Gp module and go to the dealer for the ECM Flash?

2: I also have the opportunity to install the GP from VGPWR. Bosch metal for 2005-2006 Jeep CRD European model 11V. But I wonder if this is the right choice because we have winter temperatures of -30 degrees celcius. The advantage is that I would not need to go through the dealer ....

GreenDieselEngineering wrote:

The 11 volt glow plugs are old technology, Chrsyler used this style on the early model Jeep CRD for the export market. Based on recollection these plugs have an operating temp around 1000 F and take 10 seconds of pre-glow to heat up. With the control system on the 2005-06 CRDs, the plugs would not be provided full power and will never reach 1000 F. For reference the stock ceramic plugs operate close to 1300 F and the fast metallic glow plugs are around 1100 F.

Ideally, if someone wanted to use the 11 volt glow plugs it would be better to have a stand alone control system/relay wired to the battery with a toggle switch for manual control. Still, it is stepping back in time and capability.

What is the right choice ?

3:I need your advice for the job of head motor. Is there any special steps to follow?
Do I have to change other parts in addition of the head gasket?
This garage has changed my timing belth, water pump and thermostat last summer. They did not change the tensioner and idler pulley. He has checked and tell me they were still good and they will be good for another 160 000km (next change timing belth).
Should i take the opportunity to change them?

All your advice will be greatly appreciated !!

Wobbly · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 2:43 pm

Factory service manual:

"Compare the removed glow plug with a new one. If there are missing parts of the ceramic heating element, remove all fragments from the combustion chamber before you start the engine. CYLINDER HEAD WILL NEED TO BE REMOVED"

alphred · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:00 pm

Sorry Wobbly... I do not understand what you mean.

Wobbly · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 4:33 pm

Using Google Translate:

Citant les instructions de service:

"Comparez la bougie enlevée par un nouveau. S'il ya des pièces manquantes de l'élément chauffant en céramique, enlever tous les fragments de la chambre de combustion avant de démarrer le moteur. CULASSE SERA doivent être retirés "

La photo de la bougie dont vous avez retiré montré que la pointe était manquant.

The photo of the glow plug which you removed showed that the tip was missing.

alphred · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:16 pm

Lol ... I understand the words....
I mean why you said that ... Because you think that pull the head of it's the best solution ?

I can't know if The tip is missing. Maybe it attached to the metallic core that remains in the head. I don't have apply the Camo technic, I'm too chicken lol.
I have try Driving the jeep around the house to know if I can move it to the garage in sted of towing it. the dealer said to me that it's safe.

But with the sound that I have hear (loud pop and a air sound)
the jeep will be tow and a garage and they will pull of the head to remove the broken GP and the 3 others. They will also verify that I have nothing in the cylinder.
I pray that there is no damage in inside of the engine.

I know it's the most expensive solution but I think it' the safe solution. What you think ?
I don't know if we will keep the KJ, we still have payments on it and in 1 year, it will have cost around 4000$ in repair :banghead:

Just for the head gasket kit it 390$can. Now i Know why you call them Stealer ....
:5SHOTS:

Wobbly · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:49 pm

If the tip dropped into the cylinder there may serious damage to the head, valves, and possibly the cylinder liner and the piston.

You need to find a mechanic who has experience working on this engine and who has the required special tools.

The quote of $2300 just to remove and replace the head and glow plugs seems very high.
If there is major damage, the cost of parts and labor will probably exceed the cost of a replacement engine from a wrecking yard. You might be able to sell the turbo, some injectors and other parts, like the starter and alternator from your engine.

Some of the Canadian forum members might know of a good place to do the repair or do an engine swap.

alphred · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:05 pm

Thank you Wobbly !

here at Québec, I think it's impossible to find a mechanic who has experience of this engine.

I agree with you that $ 2300 (taxes included 13.5%) is expensive, but the garage working $ 70/h and if I go to the dealer is $110/h...

Help need !!Broken glow plug ! What to do ?

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