Flywheel cracked. Terrible noise on my CRD engine.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

I started to hear a noise coming from the engine when I accelerate. When in constant speed the noise is gone and it is usually noticeable when in high speed, 55 mph+ when I accelerate.
I went to the mechanic and he says it is a part called "flywheel" that has a crack and will eventually break. I actually saw the crack myself in the steel. This part is supposedly attached to the the torque convertor or pairs converter and it is part of the automatic transmission process. Supposedly the part is in constant torque tension when in use and after some time and mileage can eventually break. This was the explanation from the mechanic. Is this possible? (I am at 60,000 + miles).
Contrary to what the mechanic was saying that it was a bad decision to go home with my KJ since they didnt have the car part and it had to be imported from the US, I decided to go anyways. I started to drive and the noise was a lot worst. After a few blocks, it was too loud and I stopped and got towed. Before going to the mechanic it was just a a very low noise only noticeable when accelerating in high speeds. Now it is extremely loud. I just left my KJ for 1 day in the mechanic shop without being present while they disassembled it to find the problem.
Any comments? If it is just the flywheel that is cracked and it is just that, somebody can recommend me an online car parts dealer where I can buy a new one?

Miyanovich · **Posted:** Sun May 06, 2012 10:34 am

hgrimberg,

While a cracked flywheel is something that is odd for a an SUV or smaller vehicle at 60,000 miles, I personally am not surprised if you have a Jeep with a cracked flywheel at low mileage.

Not sure how much reading you've done here at the CRD forum, but a thorough look-around should indicate that Jeep / Chrysler dropped the ball big time, in a number of different areas, for their CRD's. A number of us love our CRD's and are gluttons for punishment.

Personally, I just had to get $4000 worth of work done on the Jeep, because of a Turbo Charger failure at 56,000 miles. My Jeep went into the shop on February 22nd, and is still there, due to problems with getting parts from MOPAR / Chrysler.

My advice would be to try to research this site and talk to people about what might be the cause of flywheel crack, before you have your mechanic install a new one, because you might end up cracking the new one, or worse.

I have read a lot about Transmission and Torque Converter problems, so, you might want to try to talk to some of the more knowledgable people on the forum about these things. I would say, whatever you do, don't rush through this. Get information from CRD specialists before you proceed.

The one flywheel related problem that I can comment on, which is one of the fixes currently going on with my Liberty, is the replacement of the Flywheel hub. I'm not sure about the Cherokee, but I know that generally, high RPM activity can loosen the flywheel hub bolts and cause problems. Not sure if this relates to your problem.

In terms of looking for parts online, you can start with calling any number of the online MOPAR sources.

And while I've heard conflicting reports, if you have problems with Chyrsler / MOPAR, you can try VM Motori:
Call: Diana Dupuie

VM Motori North America
1187, Centre Drive Auburn Hills
Detroit, Michigan 48326

eMail:ddupuie@vm-na.com
Phone: 248-977-5901

At the minimum, maybe they can point you in the right direction.

I hope you have better luck than I did getting your hands on parts. It's been a nightmare recently.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sun May 06, 2012 2:05 pm

With the Automatic Transmission, you have a flex plate and not a flywheel, the flex plate/torque converter acts like a flywheel as far as the engine cares.
Make sure the mechanic uses thread locker on the four bolts that bolt the converter to the flex plate, or the bolts are pretreated with blue thread locker. Loose flex plate to converter bolts are a common cause of flex plate cracking.
For performance torque converters like Suncoast, they recommend red thread locker.

Moparts America is one source: www.moparpartsamerica.com/
I can't remember the other place, hope some one else can.

Big Montana · **Posted:** Sun May 06, 2012 3:06 pm

warp2diesel wrote:

With the Automatic Transmission, you have a flex plate and not a flywheel, the flex plate/torque converter acts like a flywheel as far as the engine cares.
Make sure the mechanic uses thread locker on the four bolts that bolt the converter to the flex plate, or the bolts are pretreated with blue thread locker. Loose flex plate to converter bolts are a common cause of flex plate cracking.
For performance torque converters like Suncoast, they recommend red thread locker.

Moparts America is one source: http://www.moparpartsamerica.com/
I can't remember the other place, hope some one else can.

As someone who wants to change his TC this summer, does it sound like the original TC in his Jeep was changed and they messed up the install of the new one? Could he have had the flash and then a crap mechanic fail to tighten the bolts? Could they be liable if the bolts show no lock tight?

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sun May 06, 2012 4:49 pm

Big Montana wrote:

warp2diesel wrote:

With the Automatic Transmission, you have a flex plate and not a flywheel, the flex plate/torque converter acts like a flywheel as far as the engine cares.
Make sure the mechanic uses thread locker on the four bolts that bolt the converter to the flex plate, or the bolts are pretreated with blue thread locker. Loose flex plate to converter bolts are a common cause of flex plate cracking.
For performance torque converters like Suncoast, they recommend red thread locker.

Moparts America is one source: http://www.moparpartsamerica.com/
I can't remember the other place, hope some one else can.

As someone who wants to change his TC this summer, does it sound like the original TC in his Jeep was changed and they messed up the install of the new one? Could he have had the flash and then a crap mechanic fail to tighten the bolts? Could they be liable if the bolts show no lock tight?

Chrysler Bean Counter Engineers wanted to save cost and left the blue thread locker patch off the original bolts. Keith of GDE pointed out the replacement bolts that came with the Euro had the Blue thread locker patch. Warranty costs are the only thing Bean Counter Engineers understand, common sense escapes them because many of them never played in the sand box when they were young.
As far as anything legal goes, hgrimberg who stated, "Imported from US" will be subject to what ever his born into, elected, or appointed clowns put on their books.

Miyanovich · **Posted:** Sun May 06, 2012 6:34 pm

warp2diesel wrote:

Big Montana wrote:

warp2diesel wrote:

With the Automatic Transmission, you have a flex plate and not a flywheel, the flex plate/torque converter acts like a flywheel as far as the engine cares.
Make sure the mechanic uses thread locker on the four bolts that bolt the converter to the flex plate, or the bolts are pretreated with blue thread locker. Loose flex plate to converter bolts are a common cause of flex plate cracking.
For performance torque converters like Suncoast, they recommend red thread locker.

Moparts America is one source: http://www.moparpartsamerica.com/
I can't remember the other place, hope some one else can.

As someone who wants to change his TC this summer, does it sound like the original TC in his Jeep was changed and they messed up the install of the new one? Could he have had the flash and then a crap mechanic fail to tighten the bolts? Could they be liable if the bolts show no lock tight?

Chrysler Bean Counter Engi
neers wanted to save cost and left the blue thread locker patch off the original bolts. Keith of GDE pointed out the replacement bolts that came with the Euro had the Blue thread locker patch. Warranty costs are the only thing Bean Counter Engineers understand, common sense escapes them because many of them never played in the sand box when they were young.
As far as anything legal goes, hgrimberg who stated, "Imported from US" will be subject to what ever his born into, elected, or appointed clowns put on their books.

Warp,

Other than the discovery of this blue thread locker B.S. by CRD owners and Keith, have any former Chrysler engineers or dealer mechanics come straight out and admitted to this? Is there documentation, of a former employee, on this forum or otherwise for that obvious corner-cut??

Obviously, not questioning your claim, as I was recently able to spin my flex plate, with my pinky finger, like it was the bonus round on Wheel of Fortune.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Thank you very much for all the responses. Well, for what I can conclude after reading all of you guys comments is that my torque converter or my flex plate was replaced before and the bolts were not tighten enough. Going back to what Myanovich was saying, the flex plate is hard to crack. But yes, maybe at Chrysler, they didnt use any adhesive like the Loctite Threadlocker Blue on the bolts. But then if this is the case, then almost all Jeep Libertys CRD with automatic transmission would have had a cracked flex plate at 65,000 + miles... I still can't understand why this happened. The flex plate is made out of stainless steel and I suppose that the engineers at Chrysler designed the part to support x amounts of tensions and it wouldn't crack.
This is a video on how this whole thing is: http://www.ehow.com/video_2327503_insta ... plate.html for a GM.
My KJ was bought in Argentina, not in Europe, so I don't know what do they send over here but it is called Cherokee instead of Liberty.
What I still can't understand is why the noise was very low before going to the mechanic and now, after they disassembled the surroundings of the flex plate to see it, the noise is a lot more... Then I ran away from the mechanic shop and I had to stop the engine because the noise was so loud. I wonder if I broke some other part or even the converter torque...

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

BTW, I can't find the part by the name of flex plate in Mopar at: http://www.moparpartsamerica.com/parts/ ... ANSMISSION
The only one I find is the Drive plate... is it the same?

papaindigo · **Posted:** Mon May 07, 2012 1:37 pm

Go to http://colorado4wheel.com/manuals/Jeep/KJ/ and download a copy of the 2006 parts fiche then go to figure 2.8L-305. If it's the flex plate that's broken I think what you want is 52104369AA and you may want to get 8 new bolts which I think are 5014969AA. Don't be fooled by the illustration of #s 31-34, which includes a flywheel, as those are for engines fitted with a manual transmission hence they have a flywheel and associated manual clutch assembly instead of the flex plate and torque convertor assembly used with automatic transmissions.

If it's the hub or the torque convertor then you need other stuff.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Ok, I finally bought the PLATE Torque Converter Drive which is the real name, right? The mechanic said he has the bolts in case they are needed.
But still, what could have been the reason for the plate to crack? My fear is that the new plate will crack too if the cause is not fixed...

Miyanovich · **Posted:** Mon May 07, 2012 4:16 pm

I would put my vote in to get an entirely new set of bolts as well.

Others will have to help with possible causes outside of loose bolts, which is my guess.

Another problem here is that you seem to have a mechanic with no experience working on a CRD. I don't know if I would trust any repairs to a mechanic with zero experience on a Jeep CRD.

From what I understand, the bolts have to be torqued to spec, and covered with loctite. Anyone know the specs for the bolts being torqued?

papaindigo · **Posted:** Mon May 07, 2012 4:48 pm

Torque specs should be in the FSM that can be downloaded from the link I provided.

In fairness to his mechanic, assuming the problem is as represented, the amount of experience on a CRD is not all that relevant as the 545RFE transmission is a standard Chrysler automatic transmission that's been around in one form or another for quite some time fitted to Dodge trucks. I'd look more for experience in that area than the CRD in particular.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Mon May 07, 2012 7:09 pm

Miyanovich wrote:

Warp,

Other than the discovery of this blue thread locker B.S. by CRD owners and Keith, have any former Chrysler engineers or dealer mechanics come straight out and admitted to this? Is there documentation, of a former employee, on this forum or otherwise for that obvious corner-cut??

Obviously, not questioning your claim, as I was recently able to spin my flex plate, with my pinky finger, like it was the bonus round on Wheel of Fortune.

If you download the KJ FSM you will have all the evidence your Lawyer would need to prove the Loctite was a later occurring recommendation. Chrysler/Fiat just like every other company reserves the right to make future improvements or changes in their recommendations.
Proving that Chrysler practices Bean Counter Engineering will not win you any compensation in a Court of Law. You would stand a better chance of convicting Congress of Constitutional Malpractice and putting any of them in Prison. Just because you are right, does not mean you get anything in return.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Thank you for all the comments and recommendations. I can't understand why if it was the fact of Chrysler not using Loctite with the bolts, why is that this crack in the drive plate doesn't occur to everybody and it is not so common. My fear is that the real reason of the crack could be something else and that if I replace the part, it'll crack again...

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Wed May 09, 2012 4:23 pm

hgrimberg wrote:

Thank you for all the comments and recommendations. I can't understand why if it was the fact of Chrysler not using Loctite with the bolts, why is that this crack in the drive plate doesn't occur to everybody and it is not so common. My fear is that the real reason of the crack could be something else and that if I replace the part, it'll crack again...

A crack on a flex plate is caused by fatigue. There are a lot of factors such as where in the tolerance for the hardness the metal was after stamping,was it tempered properly, how many bolts were loose, how far out of balance the torque converter was, how many starts and stops of the engine, loading factors, on and on. The point is that with a very strong tune and a good torque converter such as a Suncoast that is put together with Loctite on the four bolts, it all holds together. Put even a Suncoast into a CRD with a strong tune with out Loctite, the flex plate cracks.
Point is, put it together with Loctite, torque it up and it will work.
Euro use Blue Loctite. Suncoast or other performance billet type converter use Red Loctite.

Miyanovich · **Posted:** Wed May 09, 2012 4:35 pm

Warp,

When a person uses a torque converter, does it come with any kind of hub assembly, that replaces the OEM Flex Plate Hub?

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Wed May 09, 2012 5:19 pm

Miyanovich wrote:

Warp,

When a person uses a torque converter, does it come with any kind of hub assembly, that replaces the OEM Flex Plate Hub?

No, two separate items.

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Mon May 14, 2012 9:02 am

hgrimberg

In the US when one orders a replacement torque converter from Chrysler it comes with new bolts that have blue thread locker on them :SOMBRERO:

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Just bought the flex plate. No bolts.

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hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

They want to charge me $1250 for replacing a flex plate and rectifying a torque converter plus an oil and filter change! Dont you guys think it is too much?

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Flywheel cracked. Terrible noise on my CRD engine.

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