CRD Owners--your advice?
I'm shopping around for a "new" vehicle. I'm intrigued by the Liberty CRD, and I like diesels for the usual reasons.

I've researched the CRD to death, and I'm confident I want one . . . but I'm having trouble finding the "right" one nearby. There's one in another town, about 2.5 hours away. 06 Sport, 79k miles. They initially asked 12,900. I talked them down to $10,900. Clean Carfax; maintenance appears to be regular and consistent, but . . . three owners! And, the dealer put a lot of work into it after they took it in:

Good: New front pads and rotors, new serpentine belt
Bad: Replaced an axle seal, fixed a leaking transmission pan, replaced rear ball joints.

Exterior looks great--no rust, dents, noticeable scratches.

The price seems right, but all the work they've had to put into it sounds a little scary--and it's had three owners.

Whadya think? Run away?
Thanks!
ThaddeusV

Price seems reasonable and none of that work looks too surprising other than "rear ball joints" which doesn't quite make sense to me. IIRC the rear suspension has a single ball joint in the upper control arm (above the differential) and 2 lower control arms with no ball joints; the latter might qualify for a recall replacement if the vehicle has been in snow/salt country. Other than that read Sir Sam's NOOB guide and figure on replacing fluids (tranny, antifreeze, and oil) ASAP unless you are sure what's in there is spec (ATF+4, HOAT and proper weight diesel spec synthetic respectively). Longer term you will need a timing belt at 100k but if you are close to a member with tools that's doable.

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs

Thanks, papaindigo. I probably got the info confused; maybe he said front? In any event it's a Jeep dealer, I'll look at their records. This car is in Wisconsin, so maybe it is recall work.

The timing belt has me a little nervous, too--I had one fail prematurely on a Volvo which ruined valves. I can do some things, but that job seems a bit out of my league. Need to find someone in the greater Chicago area who will do it. Any recommendations would be appreciated.

I read that noob guide--extremely helpful!



Thaddeus

The only way I would buy another CRD would be from a member of this forum. No dealer or mechanic has this much specific knowledge of this vehicle. And any person who does, is a member. There are too many preventative maintenance items as well as upkeep maintenance items that these Jeeps need in order to stay healthy. I have owned my CRD for 1 year and 19K miles. I have put $3K in maintenance into it, and that doesn't include the lift and tires, lights, navigation and audio. Without the lift, I would have had to do the shocks and springs any way. Without any customizing, I would be +/- $3,500 into this Jeep in one year and 20K....

Now, with all the repairs and another $3K in customization, I have a bad @$$ Jeep that you don't see every soccer mom in America driving. I get 32 mpg on the highway and 20 in the city. I can tow 5,000 lbs, and have loads of torque as soon as i hit the pedal. I love this thing to death. but there were a few points in the beginning where I was close to my breaking point and wanted it gone. If it had a previous owner who frequented this site, and most of the maintenance was up to date, I would have likely kept some of that cash in my pocket and had a few less headaches. I think most of my large repairs are done for a while. Im think I will have a new battery and alternator soon and then small items until the timing belt in about 2 years.

Search for a used one int he classifieds here. Then search the members post history. Read all the problems they posted about and then all their solutions. If you don't have cash, i believe chase and wells fargo will give auto loans for a private party purchase. The dealer wont do brown stinkies for you as far as a warranty goes. If your the fourth owner, there is no Chrysler warranty (as far as I know they are only transferable to the 2nd owner). And as far as the dealers limited 3 month 3k mile warranty - the peace of mind i would have knowing what i was buying from a long time member here would have my mind at ease for a lot longer than 3 months or 3k miles.

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05 CRD Limited
GDE Hot Tune
Samco CAC Hoses
OME 790 and Bilstein 916 up front
OME 948 and OME N132L in rear
245/75/16 Treadwright Warden A/T on Richard Cepek DC-2
Euro torque converter
Renegade roof lights
Pioneer Z110bt double din navi w/ reverse cam

$3,000? I'm curious as to what you needed to do?

My plans for upgrades were:
1. GDE tune
2. Replace boost hoses
3. Possibly a Provent, but may just try the Elephant Hose fix to see how that goes.

I can probably wait at least a year or two to get the timing belt done. I don't use a car to commute, so I don't expect to put that many miles on it--mostly around town, and vacations.

Oil and other fluid changes I can do myself. I can also do other basic maintenance (brakes, fuel filter, etc if necessary).

What else am I missing?

Around town driving is the worst thing that you can do to a diesel. They like to be driven on the highway or for long periods. Stop and go is a spell for trouble and short engine life on any diesel engine.

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Mike Rausch
Bear, Delaware
2006 Liberty Sport CRD 253K

On the TB check viewtopic.php?f=5&t=60730&hilit=trust* for trusted mechanic suggestions. Also there may be experienced members in your area. Also IIRC GDE will do TBs and they are not "that" far away from the Chicago area.

Other things
1. Air filter - ca. $15
2. If it's at a Jeep dealer I'd have them do a tranny service pre-purchase just to avoid the mess of doing it yourself
3. Would be good to pre-purchase pull the airbox to turbo hose to check for split/tear on bottom just in front of turbo and while in there check for any play in the turbo wheel (slight for/aft is ok should have zero side to side)
4. if it has an original red top battery it's going to need a new one before winter.
5. drive it an make sure the temp gauge gets upto vertical or slightly left of vertical without the AC on. If not dealer needs to install new OEM tstat.

As to 1) buying from members and 2) in town driving. My personal opinion only - 1) wonderful idea if possible and there are a few for sale but... the 3 local ones I know of (mine, stoutdogs and mikeonabike) were all used purchases and other than 1 split OEM boost hose I know of no problems other than usual (tires, batteries, tstat, etc) stuff that one would expect on most any vehicle and 2) short drives with engine not warmed up are hard on any vehicle but the CRD warms up rapidly and while I don't know about engine life we put 125k miles on a 1993 Dodge Cummins doing that type of driving with zero diesel related problems.

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs

I keep good records lol. Its all around $6k:

10/03 - alternator decoupler went
10/15 - previous owner installed daystar spacers were replaced with OME/bilstein
10/15 - new UCAs installed
10/15 - new front rotors and pads
10/17 - alignment
10/31 - new thermostat
11/01 - double din navigation, back up camera, speakers
12/07 - new torque converter under warranty
01/19 - new tires and alignment
01/24 - brake fluid flush
01/25 - front left wheel bearing, parking brake shoes and hardware, rear brake pads
01/26 - GDE hot tune
01/31 - coolant flush
02/02 - rear drive shaft u joints
02/04 - front left lower ball joint and renegade roof lights
02/06 - serpentine belt
02/16 - serpentine belt and belt tensioner
02/20 - finally removed rear spacers and installed the other half of the ome/bilstein set
02/28 - new front left axle seal, new right front wheel bearing,
05/01 - 2nd torque converter warranty
06/20 - new left front lower control arm bushings
08/26 - new right front lower control arm bushing, new rear upper control arm with ball joint and bushings, power steering rack bushings, rear pinion seal

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05 CRD Limited
GDE Hot Tune
Samco CAC Hoses
OME 790 and Bilstein 916 up front
OME 948 and OME N132L in rear
245/75/16 Treadwright Warden A/T on Richard Cepek DC-2
Euro torque converter
Renegade roof lights
Pioneer Z110bt double din navi w/ reverse cam

Go for it Rusty!

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U.S. Army Retired

spitfire36o - not to start a lengthy argument but for ThaddeusVenture's benefit I'd say your list includes lots of things that are owner options or regular (gasser or diesel) KJ repairs. We can certainly discuss which "regular" KJ repairs are routine or DCJ inflicted problems by my point is that they are not KJ CRD specific. The KJ CRD specific items I see are:
1. thermostat - DIY $100-150 - over complex and CRD specific with somewhat short life span
2. alternator decoupler - DIY $150 if you go with a lifetime warranty replacement alternator. I suspect alternator decouplers can fail on any engine but as with the torque convertor perhaps more often on the diesel.
3. torque convertor - in your case $0 as warranty and any TC can go although I'd concede the CRD may go more frequently so I'd say this is a bit marginal as to being CRD specific since there are plenty of folks with lots of miles on the 2n Gen (not Euro) TC with no problems. Can be DIY but if not there are options for under $1,000 installed.
Those items are not much but in fairness I'd say the GDE tune (ca. $500) is such a valuable pro-active action it really should be listed as "fixing" things (EGR and intake soot for example) before they break.

Add to that the known need for a timing belt at 100,000 miles.

PS - I've gone for it twice so....

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs

Thanks, Pop!

The big question is, what would Brock Samson drive?

Agreed, I can probably do the thermostat and the alternator myself (I've replaced an alternator before). The TC, definitely not. One thing I am wondering--I'm sure the answer is buried in the dialog somewhere--has anyone figured out if the TC they give you in the F37 recall is better than the one that came with the car? I think I saw a note somewhere that it was the same as the Euro one, but this seemed like speculation.

Thanks
Thaddeus

Pretty much whatever the F--- he wants.

But I've heard he's a Mopar fan...

_________________
U.S. Army Retired

Regarding the torque convertor. Very early 05s had an extremely weak TC with some sort of plastic part and those TCs self destructed very quickly. Later 05s and all 06s got a "better" (what I call a 2n gen) TC but, I'm not a TC person so my terminology may be off, the springs in the TC are a bit on the weak side when mated with the KJ CRD with the original OEM ECU tune and TCM shift points. Hence the F-37 which detuned the ECU to reduce hp and torque a bit and reprogrammed the TCM to raise the speed at which the transmission shifts gears all to reduce stress on the OEM TC. The F-37 also included a check to see if the TC was failing and if so the TC was replaced with a new 2n gen TC.

Obviously what DCJ should have done was use an adequate TC in the first place and when they didn't do that they should have replaced the TC with one that was adequate for the engine power rather than "cheat" the system to reduce engine power to match the underdesigned TC. As I understand it beginning with the 07 model, export only, DCJ did install an adequate TC which folks refer to as the Euro. The Euro TC is PN 68037142AA now available only as a rebuild RL037142AA. A number of folks have installed the Euro in 05/06 US model KJ CRDs and it works just fine unfortunately just recently for some reason that TC has been restricted for export sale only in the DCJ parts network per a recent post by MrMopar64. That restriction may or may not be lifted or some folks like ID Parts may find a workaround.

To cut to the chase. Given a vehicle that has had the F-37 performed or one that has the GDE EcoTune and/or the GDE basic TCM tune the 2gen TC may last a long time or it may start to shudder and need replacement. If it needs replacement there are options. The 2gen TC won't IMHO handle hotter ECU or TCM tunes and I know for an absolute fact it won't handle the GDE Stage II turbo. How well the 2gen TC will stand upto towing, especially heavy towing in hilly terrain, I don't know although I do know stoutdog and I drove from Tempe, AZ to Tallahassee, FL in a fully loaded 06 with a stock 2gen TC/GDE EcoTune/GDE TCM tune pulling a 5X8 UHaul weighling ca. 2,0000lbs + loaded with zero TC problems.

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs

Papindigo, thanks for clearing that up about the TC. I probably won't be towing much in the near future. I might get a smaller trailer to tow my motorcycles, or a small camper, but probably not for a while yet. So if I re-tune with GDE, I guess I'll just stick with the stock TC unless I see signs of a problem.

Another question: I see another ad for a CRD. It says the car has a "4 speed automatic" installed at an option at a cost of $825. I assume this is an error? I thought the CRD was only available with a 5 speed automatic? Was a 4 speed automatic an option? If so, is there any advantage to this 4 speed instead of the 5 speed?

Thanks again
Thaddeus

All 05/06 CRDs sold in the US came factory standard with the 545RFE automatic transmission which is a 5-speed although it's a bit more complicated than that sounds. While export CRDs could be had with a manual or the 545RFE as an option that was not the case in the US.

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs

Thanks. Sounds like they made a mistake in the listing.

Brought it home this morning. 2006 with 85k miles. Ran great on the way home. Love that sound! But . . .

Wouldn't you know it -- CEL came on.

I pulled the MAP sensor per the NOOB guide and cleaned it. No CEL now.

Ordered a Fumoto for the oil pan.

Next steps--call GDE to order Eco tune, change out boost hoses for silicone.

Thanks to everyone on this site. I'm looking forward to driving the little tank!

ThaddeusV

Hope you love it and have as good service as stoutdog and I have had. Feel free to PM or email me with any questions or issues.

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Sold to LOST member my 05 Ltd, GDE Stg II turbo + TCM tune, SunCoast TC w. Transgo kit, Steiger window regulators, Samcos, Fumoto valve, 2nd gen filter head with Lub. Spec. bleeder, Hayden clutch & 11 blade fan, inverted spare, P-1 battery, BF Goodrich Long Trail TAs, Etecno1 glow plugs, timing belt at 50K miles/8 yrs