Bad diesel fuel

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

I put bad diesel fuel (or gas oil, dont know how you Britts call it) on my tank on a horrible gas station that imports diesel fuel/oil from Venezuela, therefore, the worst. Ok, right after doing it, a check engine light pop up and I scanned it and the codes I found were saying that there was water in fuel and that there was a problem with the Turbo and a few other codes more.
Now my Libby is not going more than 80 km/hour even if I hit the pedal all the way to the bottom. It is clearly under powered.
So, the logic will be that if the check engine light showed up right after pumping this diesel oil and that one of the codes was "Water in fuel", then most likely it is because of a bad diesel oil, right?

Hexus · **Posted:** Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:50 am

In the US we would file an insurance claim, most likely against the station we bought the gas from.

I don't know if that's an option for you, but I would start with getting a large container (5 gallon bucket at minimum) and using my fuel pump to remove all of the diesel from my tank.

I would then replace the fuel filter and try again, with some additive like Power Service or HEET for Diesel engines.

:2cents:

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:54 am

My recommendation is the chalk this up to experience and follow geordi's procedures for what to do if you filled up with gasoline/gas/petrol see viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69714 and scroll way down.

Short version is dump all the bad fuel; add diesel cleaner additive; replace fuel filter; refuel with good fuel; drive a bit to clean the system.

I would do this like right now before the injectors get to the point where they are so clogged as to need to be pulled and cleaned.

Insurance claim might be an option depending on what comes out of the tank. If you consider that route I'd recommend getting a video of the defueling if possible and/or have a witness(s) on hand to backup what you say.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

papaindigo wrote:

My recommendation is the chalk this up to experience and follow geordi's procedures for what to do if you filled up with gasoline/gas/petrol see viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69714 and scroll way down.

Short version is dump all the bad fuel; add diesel cleaner additive; replace fuel filter; refuel with good fuel; drive a bit to clean the system.

I would do this like right now before the injectors get to the point where they are so clogged as to need to be pulled and cleaned.

Insurance claim might be an option depending on what comes out of the tank. If you consider that route I'd recommend getting a video of the defueling if possible and/or have a witness(s) on hand to backup what you say.

Well, I'll go now to the gas station and ask them to remove all the diesel oil they poured in my tank and get a refund. If they deny, I wont file a claim because a lawyer will cost me a lot more.
What happened here was that my government ran out of US dollars to buy good oil and they started to buy the cheapest crap from this country Venezuela and all these stations from this government owned chain of stations is offering this. Inmediatly after this happened I added half a tank of diesel from Shell which is on ok one to minimize the damage. Now I will have to dump everything out of the tank. Keeping this crap on my car could really damage it, right?

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sun Jun 30, 2013 2:30 pm

Amount of possible damage depends on what kind of "stuff" is in that fuel. With any luck it's some degree of solids and water that have so plugged up your fuel filter that you cannot get any speed/power out of the engine. You will get an idea of that when you see what gets drained from the tank (NOTE if the station does the draining make it crystal clear, pardon the pun, that you want to actually be there while it's done and see what comes out in a clean clear container) and you could cut open the old fuel filter to see what it captured.

I would not want to risk operation of the vehicle with what appears to be known bad fuel. You might get lucky and just go thru several fuel filters or you might get unlucky and have enough "stuff" get past the fuel filter to destroy to some degree or other your CP3 (a.k.a. fuel pump) or 1 or more injectors. Depending on the nature of any damage to those items the parts alone could easily go past $1,000 US.

Do you "have" to discard the fuel pulled from the tank. Depends on what it looks like and whether or not you can manually filter it. If you can manually filter it then it would likely be possible to mix it with like 90%+ good fuel and use it up over time in like a farm tractor or older (pre-1993 or so) Dodge Cummins. Personally I would not try the dilute and use in a modern high pressure direct injection motor.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Well, i already diluted it in 50% with good fuel but still cant go more than 70-80 km/hour. I drove 10 miles today to this gas station but since it is Sunday they said i have to speak to the manager tomorrow and hopefully they will take the fuel out and refund me. But i ll have to drive the 10 miles again with this bad fuel...

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

After scanning the engine, I found the following codes:

P0101
P0299 LACK OF POWER ON TURBO
P1265
P1140 WATER IN FUEL CONDITION
P0183
P0504
P1263

So, it seems that if there was water in the fuel or some solid, then that stopped the turbo so the engine cant run at maximum speed. This way, the ECU protects the engine for further damages.
So, i thought that maybe if there was some water or solid that was detected but somehow passed, then if I clear and reset the codes, then unless there is more water/solids in the fuel, then the check engine light was not going to show up. So I tried that and the light didnt show up as expected. But... the turbo trouble code is still there and of course the turbo is still not running and I cant run at more than 80 km/hr.
Any ideas?
Thank you.

LMWatBullRun · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:08 am

1) drain the fuel from the tank. Flush.
2) drain water from the filter.
3) add an anti-bacterial to the new fuel.
4) bring a 2 liter jar w lid with you and test fill the jar before buying a tank from an unknown source.
5) keep a spare filter and Diesel treatment handy.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:15 am

Your problem apparently started with problematic fuel and is associated with a lack of power. Your trouble codes are odd, see below, but at minimum see what's coming out on the tank at the inflow line to the fuel filter head even if you have to run a siphon. Alternatively you might consider removal of the fuel filter and pouring its contents into like a glass jar to see what things look like. In addition go to Sam's NOOB guide and get a copy of the 06 FSM as it has most all the trouble codes and diagnostic procedures. What codes are not in the 06 FSM are in the list at viewtopic.php?f=98&t=40073

As to your codes - NOTE I strongly recommend a fuel check first as noted above.
P0101 is MAF SENSOR SIGNAL NEGATIVE DEVIATION
P0299 LACK OF POWER ON TURBO - is really BOOST PRESSURE SENSOR POSITIVE DEVIATION which under normal circumstances would imply a bad boost pressure solenoid and suggest doing the solenoid bypass to confirm
P1265 is glow plug #3 control circuit low
P1140 WATER IN FUEL CONDITION is actually VACUUM RESERVOIR SOLENOID SHORT CIRCUIT - I'm guessing but this is probably related to the P0299 - UPDATE see CATCRD's later post that P1140 may actually relate to the Flow Control Valve
P0183 - not listed in the FSM but a Google search suggests a fuel temperature sensor issue (IIRC the temp sensor is the passenger side plug on fuel filter head (see Sam's fuel filter bleeding video)
P0504 is BRAKE SWITCH SIGNAL CIRCUITS PLAUSIBILITY WITH REDUNDANT CONTACT
P1263 is glow plug #2 control circuit low

Based on your initial post I still lean toward bad fuel but assuming the codes you pulled are valid:
1. unplug the MAF sensor - doing so is harmless although it will throw a MAF code and doing so will remove a MAF sensor signal problem (it's what triggers EGR usage) from the loss of power equation.
2. ignore the 2 glow plug problems for now. It's certainly possible you have 2 bad glow plugs but that would cause hard starting in cold weather (don't know where you are, except not US, so don't know weather) not the loss of power you report. In the long run if you have bad glow plugs consider the drop in replacements from http://www.dieselglowplug.com/gx3123-di ... svli5qq877
3. unplug your fuel filter head temp sensor wire which removes that from the loss of power equation.
4. bypass the boost pressure solenoid per viewtopic.php?f=5&t=70602&p=757348&hilit=boost+solenoid#p757348 (link corrected) and check for a collapsed vacuum line per viewtopic.php?f=5&t=61240
See if doing this, all steps, brings power back.

I'm assuming you are not trailing a cloud of dark black smoke which would imply a split in one or both CAC hoses. It's also possible that one of the above or something else has kicked the vehicle into "limp" mode but I cannot offer much advice on tracing that problem down other than it would not be glow plug related.

As to the brake switch code I cannot comment other than what the FSM says.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

First I want to thank you all for your great help!
Just so you know, these trouble codes are probably old and left overs from issues I had before and that I didnt clear those from the ECU. Just last week I replaced the 4 glow plugs because I had issues on 2 of them. I bought those 7V italian glow plugs.
Then, yesterday, I cleared all the trouble codes and then only the P0299 showed up again. So it means the Turbo is underboost. But what surprised me is that the Water in fuel condition code didnt show up again. So, is that meaning that the water or solid that was detected before has gone and the rest of the fuel is ok so my ECU is not detecting that issue anymore? Then the rest of the fuel should be ok and I can keep it?
So now my only problem is the turbo not working because it was disconnected by the same ECU to prevent further damage when it found the water in fuel. How do I make the turbo work again?

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:46 am

Here is what I'd recommend:
1. as noted you did not get a code for water in the fuel. The only code that remotely relates to water in the fuel is P2264 and that code has to do with a WIF sensor problem. If you have water in the fuel then the water in the fuel light on the dash should light up. That light is on the right side just above the coolant temp gauge and looks like a fuel pump in a rainstorm. When you 1st switch on your ignition make sure that light comes on to confirm that it's working.
2. to check on your fuel. Remove the fuel filter (easiest way is to push, don't pull, the inflow/outflow hoses off; unplug the 2 electrical connections; undo the 2 bolts holding the filter head to its bracket; lift the assembly up and unplug the WIF sensor. Empty the contents of the filter into like a glass jar and look for a) water at the bottom (unlikely if sensor is ok) and/or b) crud in the fuel. If ok then reverse the process to reinstall the filter; bleed the filter to reprime it (NOTE I'd use a piece of clear vinyl hose if you can get it and bleed into a clear glass jar to see what comes "thru" the filter after all the air comes out. If fuel just kind of dribbles out chances are the filter is clogged.) At this point if all is ok they you "may" be able to keep the fuel. However, I am concerned that you say you are limited to 70-80km per hr and would give serious consideration, given your fuel comments, to just replacing the filter (don't know what they cost where you are but in the US it's like $27). I say this because I'm not sure that lack of boost would limit your top end speed although I do know from forum chat that it will severely limit how fast speed builds up which may appear as if you are limited to 70-80km per hr when in reality it simply takes forever to go any faster. Also you don't mention lots of black smoke which is typically associated with dumping poorly burned fuel due to lack of boost.
3. With respect to the P0299 see my comment #4 above and follow-up on the links. If the vacuum line is toast just bypass the bad section(s) if the boost pressure solenoid cures your problem get Mopar PN 4606226AC. FYI you can drive for however long you want with the solenoid bypassed just remember that it's what ensures a vacuum is stored in the black vacuum "tower" overnight and that it will take 10-15 seconds to build enough vacuum for your turbo boost to work properly when you crank up as long as the solenoid is bypassed.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Ok, I just talked to the Quality department from the company I bought diesel fuel from and this engineer told me that they import diesel from Russia and that it only has 10 parts in 1 million of sulfur. He says that the detection of water in fuel condition must be a detection of humidity at the pre-filter of fuel and that is probably due to filling fuel on an almost empty tank (which is what I did).
So, if the fuel is clean and therefore it was not bad fuel, now after clearing all the codes and not seeing again the Water in fuel condition code again, all I have to do is re-activate the turbo again. How do I do that? (I have the OBDII scanner and the PC software)
Thank you.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:43 pm

What I recommended doing is posted immediately above your most recent post including how to check your turbo. You can follow the the steps I suggested or not or you can go by the word of the company quality control "expert" who obviously has no clue how a WIF sensor works nor whether or not their fuel was clean when it went into your tank nor how clean the fuel in your tank was, it's your call. If I sound testy it's because I've dealt with visibly bad fuel before notwithstanding assurances by the well known national US company (e.g. what was coming out of the tank was black as can be and full of sediment/algae due to lack of filtering at the pump) and I no longer do business with that company.

As to your turbo; it's vacuum operated (not electric unless you have the GDE Stage II turbo) as such it merely needs vacuum to operate and cannot be re-activated by a scan tool as far as I know. Assuming the engine vacuum pump is working I've given you the classic 2 reasons the turbo won't work and how to manually check them. Again check those 2 things or not, it's your call. The only thing I did not mention since it did not fit the symptoms is stuck turbo variable vanes but I'd check the other 2 things first.

If anyone else has a better idea please offer same. I'm done.

LMWatBullRun · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:55 pm

LMWatBullRun wrote:

1) drain the fuel from the tank. Flush.
2) drain water from the filter.
3) add an anti-bacterial to the new fuel.
4) bring a 2 liter jar w lid with you and test fill the jar before buying a tank from an unknown source.
5) keep a spare filter and Diesel treatment handy.

PapaIndigo has given excellent advice. The likelihood that your intercooler hoses, the other possibility for poor performance, failed at precisely the point that you bought suspect fuel is very low. Strongly suggest you look at the fuel and the filter before you worry about anything else.

CATCRD · **Posted:** Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:26 pm

As mentioned, P1140 is not a code for water in fuel. It indicates malfunctioning of the FCV (motorized throttle in intake used to enhance EGR flow). There is a special amber indicator light to tell you there is water in your fuel filter. It looks like a fuel pump with water droplets on it.

P0299, P0101 and P1140 all together suggest a problem with the EGR system. Maybe the FCV is closing too much and choking boost, or EGR valve is sticking open. Check the easy stuff first like split or loose intercooler hoses.

Dent · **Joined:** Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:05 pm **Posts:** 275

papaindigo, The link you posted for suggestion #4 is a link for a glow plug replacement, not a turbo vacuum solution.

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

Hi Papaindigo,
Thank you for all your help. It seems that I was posting here while at the same time you were responding me.
For what you say, P1140 WATER IN FUEL CONDITION is actually VACUUM RESERVOIR SOLENOID SHORT CIRCUIT, then this is not related to any water in fuel. Somehow the showing up of the check engine light happened right after filling the tank. Then I dont know what could be the relationship, if any.
I will try to see where all the parts you mention are in the engine. I'll continue searching on google for the location of all these parts and see if I can fix it.
Thank you!

papaindigo · **Posted:** Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:33 am

Sam's NOOB guide has pictures of most of the items you will be looking for, assuming they are not much different on an export 06 as opposed to a US model (I know there are some minor location differences between left and right hand drive models) and my like to the boost pressure solenoid bypass shows its location.

As Dent pointed out my original boost pressure solenoid link did not go to the right places. That has been corrected.

Hexus · **Posted:** Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:37 am

No good Deed...

ROFL..

hgrimberg · **Joined:** Mon Dec 19, 2011 11:03 pm **Posts:** 363

I didnt touch anything on the EGR system so far. I still have to find out where all these mentioned parts are located, but I cleared the trouble code P0299 three times so far. (thank you for correcting the link, papindigo) After doing it the last time, I drove on a highway at 100 km/hour after hitting the pedal to the metal for a long time. After doing this, I scanned the ECU again and instead of the usual P0299 code, I found a new code which is: P0101. P0101 seems to be: Mass or Volume Air flow circuit range/Performance problem.
Is this something new that was added? This can give us another idea?
Thank you,

Bad diesel fuel

Who is online