Timing Belt Tools for Change

connolcj · **Posted:** Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:12 pm

Hey guys i have been lurking around here for awhile as I bought a CRD a little over a month ago. I just rolled over 100,000 miles and am starting to look at getting my TB changed. I plan on changing everything while I'm in there (i.e. belt, tensioners, WP, thermostat, etc) and getting my parts from idparts.com. The problem I'm having is that I can't really afford the tools to do this. Is there anyone in the Detroit Metro area that I could borrow the tools from for cheap or know of a good place that can do the work for a fair price? GDE tools are rented out for weeks last time I checked. I want to get this done as soon as possible and any tips are appreciated. I have been reading multiple write-ups and guides, so I have a good idea what I need to do.

Thanks for the help.

Hexus · **Posted:** Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:18 pm

GDE is there in Wixom, MI.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:43 pm

You need 4 "special" things to do the TB if the water pump is included.
1. a long shaft 6mm allen key to pin the flywheel; see the 05 FSM for how to.
2. 2 cam pins which can be made. See viewtopic.php?f=98&t=72201 for pin dimensions and http://www.beesvillebeefarm.com/jeep.html for pics of DIY ones.
3. a cam gear holding tool. Ideally the Miller one but the TDI tool pictured apparently works well too. The main purpose of the holding tool is to provide counterforce while loosening/tightening the cam bolts as the cam pins are not sufficient to take the stress of the bolt torque.

FYI it's also handy to have a marking pen of some sort to mark the current position of various things (ex. a couple of fuel pump pulley teeth and the adjacent housing) to make sure stuff stays in the same position during the process.

flman · **Posted:** Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:48 pm

papaindigo wrote:

You need 4 "special" things to do the TB if the water pump is included.
1. a long shaft 6mm allen key to pin the flywheel; see the 05 FSM for how to.
2. 2 cam pins which can be made. See viewtopic.php?f=98&t=72201 for pin dimensions and http://www.beesvillebeefarm.com/jeep.html for pics of DIY ones.
3. a cam gear holding tool. Ideally the Miller one but the TDI tool pictured apparently works well too. The main purpose of the holding tool is to provide counterforce while loosening/tightening the cam bolts as the cam pins are not sufficient to take the stress of the bolt torque.

FYI it's also handy to have a marking pen of some sort to mark the current position of various things (ex. a couple of fuel pump pulley teeth and the adjacent housing) to make sure stuff stays in the same position during the process.

The FSM says, you do not need to put the fuel pump on that mark. And it makes sense since it is not an injector pump, but only a high pressure pump. Actually one I finished the head gasket I did not align it to the mark, and it runs fine.

Quote:

INSTALLATION
NOTE: There are marks on the high pressure pump gear and both camshaft gears. These ARE NOT alignment marks and should be disreguarded.

If you look at the student workbook that they are selling on Ebay, it shows the pump mark is used?

Tree Catcher · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:14 am

For the tools for a reasonable price, look up gokeeper, Ill Pm you his email addy but I have used his tools and his price is reasonable and gives you plenty of time for the use of the tools.

Sean

CATCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:02 am

flman wrote:

papaindigo wrote:

You need 4 "special" things to do the TB if the water pump is included.
1. a long shaft 6mm allen key to pin the flywheel; see the 05 FSM for how to.
2. 2 cam pins which can be made. See viewtopic.php?f=98&t=72201 for pin dimensions and http://www.beesvillebeefarm.com/jeep.html for pics of DIY ones.
3. a cam gear holding tool. Ideally the Miller one but the TDI tool pictured apparently works well too. The main purpose of the holding tool is to provide counterforce while loosening/tightening the cam bolts as the cam pins are not sufficient to take the stress of the bolt torque.

FYI it's also handy to have a marking pen of some sort to mark the current position of various things (ex. a couple of fuel pump pulley teeth and the adjacent housing) to make sure stuff stays in the same position during the process.

The FSM says, you do not need to put the fuel pump on that mark. And it makes sense since it is not an injector pump, but only a high pressure pump. Actually one I finished the head gasket I did not align it to the mark, and it runs fine.

Quote:

INSTALLATION
NOTE: There are marks on the high pressure pump gear and both camshaft gears. These ARE NOT alignment marks and should be disreguarded.

If you look at the student workbook that they are selling on Ebay, it shows the pump mark is used?

When I did my belt, my fuel pump sprocket was spot on the mark from the factory. Funny that they would do it that way if it made no difference. Assembly lines are all about saving time. If they can skip an insignificant step, they will.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:08 am

We now know from experience that it DOES make a difference if the pump pulley is NOT aligned with the factory marks. GDE STRONGLY suggests aligning the marks. I do, too.

DOC

papaindigo · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:24 am

I have no opinion one way or the other about the fuel pump timing mark although it's my understanding that the marks only line up on like every 3rd engine revolution. That said pin the cams and flywheel and before removing the timing belt witness mark 2 fuel pump pulley teeth and the adjacent housing such that when you install the new TB those fuel pump marks line up which keeps it in the same timing position as when it left the factory.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:12 pm

Pap,

I did exactly as you suggest when I did my TB. The Jeep appeared to have never been apart, but the factory marks did not line up. I put it back together exactly as it had been and it did not seem to run very well. I took it all apart at GDE's suggestion and aligned the pump pulley marks.

It then ran better than it ever had since we got it with 15K miles on it.

I believe GEORDI endorses this as well.

DOC

papaindigo · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:24 pm

I'll let geordi speak for himself but on the 3 I've assisted him with and the one I did myself we did the mark and don't move method on the fuel pump pulley with no problem and no change in how the vehicle ran. I will note that marking the fuel pump pulley is critical as is taking care not to accidentally bump that pulley; it moves extremely easily and even with the marks is bit touchy about getting lined back up.

I honestly have no clue if the fuel pump marks lined up on those 4 jobs. I doubt that happened given the odds but to be honest I did not look.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:45 pm

When I did my TB job back in the fall, the fuel pump pulley factory marks were aligned perfectly after I got the cams and flywheel pinned as required.
So, I marked everything with marking paint as papaindigo suggested before removing tension from T belt, and then realigned all the marks with proper tension on the new belt before tightening the cam bolts. Afterwards, I rotated the motor several times and rechecked all index marks to be sure everything stayed correct, and it was...
It ran perfect, and still does!!!!

CRD05il · **Posted:** Wed Jan 08, 2014 8:06 pm

connolcj wrote:

Hey guys i have been lurking around here for awhile as I bought a CRD a little over a month ago. I just rolled over 100,000 miles and am starting to look at getting my TB changed. I plan on changing everything while I'm in there (i.e. belt, tensioners, WP, thermostat, etc) and getting my parts from idparts.com. The problem I'm having is that I can't really afford the tools to do this. Is there anyone in the Detroit Metro area that I could borrow the tools from for cheap or know of a good place that can do the work for a fair price? GDE tools are rented out for weeks last time I checked. I want to get this done as soon as possible and any tips are appreciated. I have been reading multiple write-ups and guides, so I have a good idea what I need to do.

Thanks for the help.

If you want to come to chicago we could do it together. I have the tools and have done 2 of the so far. pm if you want too.

pwrwagn · **Joined:** Mon Jul 22, 2013 2:40 am **Posts:** 192

I have the tool kit from england. It has everything except the tool used to hold the gears. You can usually rent on those those (they are not specifically for the CRD).

Be happy to rent it to you for for nominal fee.

kjjet · **Posted:** Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:00 pm

Unless you continue to rotate the engine over by hand at least three times you may not see the pump alignment. GDE is correct. the pump should be timed when doing a belt change. Yes the jeep will run fine without it, but. Being timed creates less stress on the pump due to has a relief in pressure timed with maximum pressure.

That is what I was told. VW dose the same thing.

Good luck
KJJET

kjjet · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:52 am

connolcj... performing the maintenance on your own will give you lot of self satisfaction that the job was done correctly. But first you must know how to do it correctly and why.

I believe if you are going to advise anyone as to perform a job on an engine like setting the timing! Your information should be correct! Just becouse its on Youtube dose not mean its correct. I know lots of people have done this and their Jeeps are running good. But done per the Wrong way leaves room for error.

The Timing system on the CRD is like several small engines with overhead cams that lock into position, permitting the cam sprockets to move during installation of the belt. These systems permit precise setting of the cams. The basis for the correct timing (precise) is setting the crank at a 90 degrees past TDC, Pinning the cams, Loosening the Cam sprockets and setting the pump timing. The service manual then calls for installing the belt at the crank, Using a VM belt holding tool (to assure the belt stays in the grove of the crank, I use a vice grip. Not to grip down on the belt, but attached to the crank with the tip of the pliers pressing against the belt so it dose not fall out of the crank grove) You then install the belt CCW over the Pump pulleys, loosened cam sprockets then the tensioner. No moving of the Crank. (even a tiny bit)
Now set the Tensioner with the sprockets still loosened. (most important) This places a uniform tension throughout the belt. Then tighten the Sprokets! This gives you the PRECISE timing setting of the cam's to the crank! Just like the VM factory did it.

Any other way you may have the timing off slightly. Will your engine run good? Sure but you may not have the best MPG and or power you could have had.

Sorry for the long winded reply, but i believe this is very important to show new people how to do it correctly.

Good luck
KJJET

jsrmonster · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:18 am

The reason for setting correct pump timing is to minimize damaging harmonics so that the peak cylinder pressure(s) don't correspond with the peak pump pressure(s), but remain constant (benign) and don't operate around the resonant (violent) frequencies of the crank, or pump. This will not only preserve the metal fatigue of shafts, tensioners (TB/serp), etc, but also preserve belt life. Of course the pump can be positioned anywhere and it will work fine. Listen to the engineers, its usually included in the instructions for a reason.

Jeff ;-)

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:05 pm

I hadn't replied to this thread before, and forgot that it existed. Oops.

Papa indigo is correct that I do mark the sprocket and the casing for the fuel pump... HOWEVER, I am doing that because the factory notch and line are impossible to see properly when the radiator is still in place and the belt is installed. It is simply a matter of efficiency.

I always re-time the fuel pump to the factory mark, for exactly the reasons that GDE suggests that it be done. The fuel pump may or may not line up against the mark when you first get the pins inserted. If it doesn't, the solution (to line it up) is to rotate the engine twice more and look again. It takes a full SIX rotations from everybody-matching to return to everybody-matching. This is because the camshafts are rotating at 1/2 crank speed, and the fuel pump is 2/3 crank speed.

The pressure waves from the fuel pump match up to the fuel injector opening, keeping the rail pressure constant, despite being a 3-lobed pump in a 4-cylinder engine. If they were mistimed, the pressure waves would be crashing into each other causing spikes and drops in pressure as the injectors opened at uneven times, and the engine would run like crap.

If you have not re-timed the pump, but also have not shifted its position relative to the crankshaft... It is entirely possible that you have simply maintained the factory timing, which DID match.

Do not remove the pulley from the fuel pump at any time - if this happens, the CP3 pump will need to be removed and taken to a Bosch shop to be retimed internally.

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Timing Belt Tools for Change

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