Not starting still (was Air getting into filter head)

Auberon · **Posted:** Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:36 pm

Good thing.
So if I'm not mistaken that location will only show air ingress on the inlet (negative pressure side) - can you fit it between the pump and the filter head?
If you've solved most of the feed line issues it implies it's after that.

Just for reference: When I bleed/open a filter like this up I screw the bottom bowl on securely (if it has one) and then fill with perfectly clean diesel - lubricating all the seals as I go and then screw it up onto the head. To do this particular one I take it off the firewall (a process I know you've done many times) then keeping the filter level / vertical to avoid spillage I screw it on. This minimises priming and gives you a good start with the priming process. They at least sat the canister vertically to facilitate this.
Done many diesels - Kubota, Fiat, John Deere, Cat, Lister, Toyotas etc in my time - this is one of the easiest ever to bleed.
It doesn't require knowing hidden high points to bleed progressively along the lines etc - it is an endpoint bleed on a stoopid suction line - but this is wrong - just bad engineering / design if I ever saw it. It's a sad thing you can't fit a foot valve to the intake on these things. That would help. So much grief stems from the fuel system being hybridised from the petrol version.

Your lift pump will probably fix this up though as you'll push any air through. It's not perfect but it works.

I presume you tried to look for crud / obstruction in the inlet and return lines.

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2014 3:07 am

I tested the flow on the feed & return with the pump on, both flow good, I made a right mess hosing diesel everywhere :roll:

Hopefully I can replace the banjo washers without stripping too much off, will do that and the feed line tonight after work. Will buy another glass filter and fit in the feed line, don't want to take the current one out as I am confident the tank to filter is air tight now & don't want to mess with it.

Thanks

papaindigo · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2014 9:21 am

If it starts when cold and won't start when hot or post drive heat soaked have you considered a sensor that malfunctions when hot. I don't know if the 03 has one but IIRC the crank position sensor can malfunction and prevent starts when hot and not throw a code. See jeepdan's post (scroll down) in this string viewtopic.php?f=5&t=64199&start=80

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:57 am

Interesting, mine does have a cps, will check it out

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:42 pm

getting anywhere need the input on the fuel pump is a no go without stripping down the inlet manifold & alternator. Can't even get anything on the pipe clip to undo it and replace the last bit of fuel pipe, just spent an hour trying to get at it with just arms full of scratches to show for it. :banghead:

Oddly it has been okay today, any more faults & its off to a workshop to get looked at, lost the will on this issue now

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:45 am

Just died on me again. 5 mins after starting up okay it just cut out. Had enough now, its off to local mechanic tomorrow.

samse2101 · **Posted:** Tue Jan 28, 2014 9:18 am

Hi Steve,

any news? by the way: is there a nonreturn-valve anywhere near the fuel pump in the fuel tank ( means not the fuel injection pump) at our vehicles? Because in the WJ there is one, what also make some troubles sometimes...

And what do you think about the possibility of a chocked prefilter? #7 at the pic...

And what is the valve at #8 exactly for?

bye,
samse

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Tue Jan 28, 2014 9:49 am

Being looked at now. Mechanic is happy with the low pressure feed up to the filter & is currently checking outthe hp bits.

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:39 pm

Not great news from mechanic. No faults found!
He thinks there may be an issue with a sticking injector causing low pressure in the rail but wouldn't that throw codes? Even when not starting it doesn't give codes.

Any suggestions, it is looking like it will get ebayed of as a spares or repair as I can't throw money at bits hoping it fixes it.

Billwill · **Posted:** Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:53 am

steve@offroading.net wrote:

Not great news from mechanic. No faults found!
He thinks there may be an issue with a sticking injector causing low pressure in the rail but wouldn't that throw codes? Even when not starting it doesn't give codes.

Any suggestions, it is looking like it will get ebayed of as a spares or repair as I can't throw money at bits hoping it fixes it.

Low pressure in the rail should throw a code!

Are you still getting air into the fuel head?
I have seen posts where owners have replaced the fuel filter but did not notice that the original O ring for the filter had remained behind so ended up with two O rings and air in the fuel head

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Wed Jan 29, 2014 4:06 am

I am sure there is no air in the head, and was a new head & filter so no double o ring issues. Getting a crank sensor put on it today, hopefully.......

RTTT265 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:15 pm

Ours threw a code low pressure when injector washer leaking.

Crank angle sensor good idea.

At some stage I would like to try the injector spill test on ours but wouldnt be your issue.

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:33 pm

Fingers crossed it may be fixed!
Massive thanks to papaindigo for linking to that thread above, cps is now swapped & the old one tested & found to be bad.

Can't remember the scale I had on the multimeter but cold it gave about 3.2k ohms (or 32ohms), heated it slightly and it varied between open circuit & 500k ohms, not staying at any value and not consistant with heat! I have swapped a few CPS sensors on I jeeps but they just die & throw a code, never seen the symptoms I have seen on this cps, especially with no obd code.

jeepdan · **Posted:** Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:57 pm

Congrats Steve :BANANA:

The lack of any trouble codes for this gremlin was very frustrating wasn't it?

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:05 pm

Too right it was. I was for striping off the injectors next at great expense, just hope this cures it finally. Think the air in the filter was an issue but not causing the bad starting. Red herring but al least I know the low preassure side is all good now & the next filter change will be easier!

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:08 pm

Maybe a post in the CRD tech is needed so its easy info to find for the future?

samse2101 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:21 am

Congrats too!

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:41 am

4 days with no fault sp far. Need a week fault free before the doubt has gone. Will post a video later with the sensor fault

steve@offroading.net · **Posted:** Sun Feb 16, 2014 2:34 pm

finally uploaded the video of the sensor
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txVH6SF_ ... cCVrezIqsg

Stuck a post in the CRD Tech section so its easy to find if anyone else has this issue

Not starting still (was Air getting into filter head)

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