Cold Weather Performance

cevans · **Joined:** Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:48 pm **Posts:** 278

Finally got to take my Jeep on a really good cold weather trip. I put pipe insulation on the grill to try and keep the temperature up, but my weak thermostat still wasn't able to keep up.

The temperature dropped quickly. 80MPH at 14 degrees F.

Which resulted in this:

The next morning it was -10F, and starting the KJ was...interesting...perhaps "exciting"...

We got in late, so I didn't have the presence of mind to leave the block heater plugged in. I remembered about an hour before we had to leave, but, it didn't help. The block heater can maintain some warmth on a hot engine, but, it is way too weak to warm up a -10F block. Took about 10 tries.

I *think* I got the hang of it though. I turn the key and let the lift-pump run for the full cycle. I do this until the pitch of the lift pump changes, indicating the system is fully pressurized. I then crank until it catches once and stop immediately to prevent death rattle/smoking. I repeat this process a bunch, not letting it catch, to build up heat in the cylinders. Then, on the 10th try, it fires up *fairly* smoothly.

I've got the Bosch 5V steel, but, I miss the 7V ceramics. I've been pushing NGK to make a ceramic plug for us, but, the volume is too small to make it worthwhile they say. I hope we can convince someone, somewhere to make ceramics again...

OneCheekRider · **Posted:** Fri Jan 16, 2015 11:31 am

Do you use a fuel addictive? I've been adding the winter PowerService and it starts up with only minor hesitation on the first crank with my 7v Etecno's when not plugged in at sub zero temps.

I've also been using my block heater every morning set on a timer to about 2.5 hours before I leave in the morning. I enjoy the quick starts and the engine getting to temp faster. At work I try to plug in about 2 or 3 hours before I leave too.

dirtmover · **Posted:** Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:03 pm

You're going to a lot of effort to prevent the rattle but this raises a couple of questions:

- I too cringe at the rattle/smoke but is it really that bad for the engine?
- Would it be beneficial if we could cut the signal to the injectors and allow it to crank for a few seconds before providing fuel?

I've only ever run with ceramics and have spares to keep me going a bit longer. Seeing these vehicles having more starting issues as they age I'm kind of thinking the reward may be worth the risk.

diesel_guy86 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 16, 2015 1:50 pm

It's a diesel.

Any diesel at -10 is going to rattle and shake.

Turn key to on, wait for buzzers to go off, then start.

Many have indicated that the glow plugs are actually on longer than the glowplug light suggests. I use to go by the light and had looong starts. Now I wait until the chimes go away and it starts up much better. Mine will start this way down to 0 to -5f on 3 glowplugs, the first time. I'm using the 7v etecnos.

cevans · **Joined:** Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:48 pm **Posts:** 278

diesel_guy86 wrote:

It's a diesel.

Any diesel at -10 is going to rattle and shake.

Turn key to on, wait for buzzers to go off, then start.

Many have indicated that the glow plugs are actually on longer than the glowplug light suggests. I use to go by the light and had looong starts. Now I wait until the chimes go away and it starts up much better. Mine will start this way down to 0 to -5f on 3 glowplugs, the first time. I'm using the 7v etecnos.

Last year I investigated the "how long do the glow plugs actually stay on" question, and, in fact, the light indicates accurately when the glow plugs at full duty cycle. They only go through a full cycle for few seconds and then they go into maintenance mode, a much lower duty cycle, where they no longer heat up further but just keep some existing heat. Multiple cycles might heat up the metal around the plug *slightly*.

I know I need to lengthen the plug-in time, thats for sure. I'm going to write Etecno so see if they have a peak temperature specification. I'd love to compare the peak temp of Bosch 5V vs Etecno 7V.

cevans · **Joined:** Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:48 pm **Posts:** 278

dirtmover wrote:

You're going to a lot of effort to prevent the rattle but this raises a couple of questions:

- I too cringe at the rattle/smoke but is it really that bad for the engine?
- Would it be beneficial if we could cut the signal to the injectors and allow it to crank for a few seconds before providing fuel?

I've only ever run with ceramics and have spares to keep me going a bit longer. Seeing these vehicles having more starting issues as they age I'm kind of thinking the reward may be worth the risk.

I don't know if it is bad...but I'm guessing that it is combustion that is occurring while the piston is traveling up...that can't be good for rods & bearings. Then again, the 7.3L Powerstrokes are the kings of death rattle and seem to last forever....

mass-hole · **Posted:** Fri Jan 16, 2015 2:20 pm

cevans wrote:

dirtmover wrote:

You're going to a lot of effort to prevent the rattle but this raises a couple of questions:

- I too cringe at the rattle/smoke but is it really that bad for the engine?
- Would it be beneficial if we could cut the signal to the injectors and allow it to crank for a few seconds before providing fuel?

I've only ever run with ceramics and have spares to keep me going a bit longer. Seeing these vehicles having more starting issues as they age I'm kind of thinking the reward may be worth the risk.

I don't know if it is bad...but I'm guessing that it is combustion that is occurring while the piston is traveling up...that can't be good for rods & bearings. Then again, the 7.3L Powerstrokes are the kings of death rattle and seem to last forever....

Why would it be combusting early in a cold motor, wouldnt it be late?

I have found that if I plug it in before bed, regardless of how long it was sitting or how cold it is, the block heater does get it up to temp. I have forgotten before and plugged it in an hour or so ahead of time and it was pointless. I will also leave the block heater plugged in after i start it and it is idling in the driveway and it seem to help warm the engine up quite a bit.

The grill blanket on mine helps the block heater by keeping some of the wind out of the engine bay. It also saves me on the long downhills where you are not using the throttle. If I have the HVAC heat running at all the engine used to cool off while coasting, even with the stant thermostat, but is much less prone to this with the cover.

flman · **Posted:** Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:30 pm

cevans wrote:

Finally got to take my Jeep on a really good cold weather trip. I put pipe insulation on the grill to try and keep the temperature up, but my weak thermostat still wasn't able to keep up.

The temperature dropped quickly. 80MPH at 14 degrees F.

Which resulted in this:

The next morning it was -10F, and starting the KJ was...interesting...perhaps "exciting"...

We got in late, so I didn't have the presence of mind to leave the block heater plugged in. I remembered about an hour before we had to leave, but, it didn't help. The block heater can maintain some warmth on a hot engine, but, it is way too weak to warm up a -10F block. Took about 10 tries.

I *think* I got the hang of it though. I turn the key and let the lift-pump run for the full cycle. I do this until the pitch of the lift pump changes, indicating the system is fully pressurized. I then crank until it catches once and stop immediately to prevent death rattle/smoking. I repeat this process a bunch, not letting it catch, to build up heat in the cylinders. Then, on the 10th try, it fires up *fairly* smoothly.

I've got the Bosch 5V steel, but, I miss the 7V ceramics. I've been pushing NGK to make a ceramic plug for us, but, the volume is too small to make it worthwhile they say. I hope we can convince someone, somewhere to make ceramics again...

Get a hold of George at VM Specialists, he can get ceramic in 5, 7, or 11 volts. I am not sure if he would work with you on a better deal as a reseller?

info (AT) vmdieselspecialist.co.uk

And also, just start it and let it shake and rattle a few seconds, better then all that wear and tear on starting components, ect.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 3:00 pm

No more ceramics from that UK company.

DOC

minisub · **Posted:** Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:58 pm

diesel_guy86 wrote:

It's a diesel.

Any diesel at -10 is going to rattle and shake.

Turn key to on, wait for buzzers to go off, then start.

Many have indicated that the glow plugs are actually on longer than the glowplug light suggests. I use to go by the light and had looong starts. Now I wait until the chimes go away and it starts up much better. Mine will start this way down to 0 to -5f on 3 glowplugs, the first time. I'm using the 7v etecnos.

I've been doing the same. Wait for the chimes and it starts much easier.

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

cevans wrote:

I've got the Bosch 5V steel, but, I miss the 7V ceramics. I've been pushing NGK to make a ceramic plug for us, but, the volume is too small to make it worthwhile they say. I hope we can convince someone, somewhere to make ceramics again...

Cold Weather Performance

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