Need some input from anyone who has seen this before, please...

Our '06 Liberty CRD with 85,000 miles, regular oil changes, had EGR problems fixed by Green Diesel Tuning just quit. My wife was driving it and said it started making a "hammering" noise, lost power and she drove into a nearby parking lot. When we towed it home, it started and made that noise and smoked very much from the exhaust. CEL did not immediately come on but when it did it showed P0304 for "cylinder 4 misfire detected". After removing the top cover and starting it again, there is no air coming from around the injectors (I originally thought it might be a blown injector seal) and the knocking noise is more detectable lower in the crankcase.

My thoughts at this time are around a broken rod or bearing cap. Has anyone had this happen before? All I can read and see about the CRD is that it is very reliable regarding the crankshaft and lower end. Oil has been changed with Mobil 1 0W40 no more than 6,000 miles and it sees very little off road, dirty service.

Thoughts?

Thank you very much.

Kurt
Calhoun, Ga.

injector stuck open , over fuel makes bad noise , smoke , etc , check your injectors , !!!!!!

I pretty sure that if a connecting rod were broken, the engine would not run at all.
It could be that you have one or more excessively worn rod bearings and what you are hearing is "rod knock."
Or it could be a miss firing or over fueled injector.

Easy way to check is:
1. Start the engine.
2. Pull the injector connectors one at a time.
3. If the bad noise stops when that injector is disconnected, that's where your bad injector is.
4. If the bad noise does not stop when any are disconnected, then the problem is probably in your rod or crank bearings.

Honestly, there are many more things that it could possibly be. Let's just hope that it's a injector or fuel system problem.

_________________
U.S. Army Retired

90% sure it's a broken rocker.

You can get a hold of someone like Geordi, or myself if you want someone to come to you (depends on where you live). I see you're in Calhoun Georgia, close to both of us really, I'm in Nashville and Geordi is near the coast in Savannah.

Most Dealerships can't or won't do the work, and if they will they want $4000+ (No joke) to do it. Most local shops are ill-equipped to do the work, although some have been diamonds in the rough.

It requires special tools (some of which you can make or fabricate) that really aren't for any other type of vehicle in the world.

I'm not trying to discourage you.

If the noise is like you said, don't run it any more than you have to. Have it towed, and DO NOT START IT. You're just doing more damage and chancing valve/head damage past a point.

Hammering noise is rocker/lifter issues, most typically.

_________________
Silver 2006 KJ 2.8L CRD Limited:
GDE ECO Tune / Fumoto Valve / E-Tecno GX3123 7v Glow Plugs / 2nd Gen Fuel Head / Mishimoto RED Hoses / Rockers/Lifters @ 114k / Hayden FC + 11 Blade Nylon / Sears P1 Battery / Transgo 45RFE-HD2 Reprogramming Kit / Timken Front Bearings

I disconnected injector plugs one at a time. It would not start with front, 3rd from front and rear. 2nd from front disconnected allowed the motor to run and noise was maybe not as bad.

One item to note, the knocking cannot be heard while cranking and is not constant with every revolution while rinning. (That is encouraging to me)

Oil and coolant both are clean.

Hexus, how do I contact you? You are a few hours closer than Savannah.

I disconnected injector plugs one at a time. It would not start with front, 3rd from front and rear. 2nd from front disconnected allowed the motor to run and noise was maybe not as bad.

One item to note, the knocking cannot be heard while cranking and is not constant with every revolution while rinning. (That is encouraging to me)

Oil and coolant both are clean.

Hexus, how do I contact you? You are a few hours closer than Savannah.

Also, I thinking if a rod were broken, the piston would not move and therefore would not be pumping out any smoke. Yes, it smoked heavily when it first started.

You'd be surprised how these engines will operate with a broken or breaking-in-progress rod. It has happened to me twice.

Did the engine sound like this:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5447172/jeep-engine.mov

That is a video of my second engine with 134k miles, about 5 minutes (of idling time) before the #4 rod cap came off entirely and the bottom of the rod was jammed through the side of the block where the EGR valve had been.

I'm not trying to be doom-and-gloom even though it might feel like it. I'm not confident that this IS a rocker issue, but it COULD be. It is about a 50/50 shot. The good news is that the rockers are the designed failure point, so they ARE the weak point in the engine. Also, the resulting combustion with broken rockers can be *VERY* unhappy sounding, or not as bad. You could have the bad version. The only way to be certain is to pull the top off and look at the rockers.

You don't need to worry about the timing or pins if you are going to disassemble the engine to the rockers and have a look - the timing can be reset easily with the valve cover off, and you won't hurt anything at all. How confident are you working on cars? I will be going to Greensboro in the next few days, so if you pull the valve cover and find the rockers bad, I can build it back up from that point and you are back and running this week.

This would also be a good time to think about the ARP studs and the intake elbow if you haven't done either of those, since the labor is the same for the studs and the rockers - but I would pull the engine apart before ordering anything, just in case it IS the bottom end, you haven't bought anything that you didn't need yet.

Send me a PM and we can discuss your options.

_________________
Proud supporting vendor of LOST Jeeps
TRAVELING CRD TECH. I come to you!
Need help? Just ask! I've taken it apart more than most.
Email jeep [at] maincomputer [dot] com - BOARD MESSAGING IS BROKEN
Over 225 CRDs currently driving with my valves, timing belt, rockers, or ARP Studs.
Bad noises = REALLY bad things.

first check injectors return flow ,cup test , and report ,or pull them out and get fuel shop to check your injectors

We have either a piston cracked or a rod problem. Does anyone want to buy this and fix it up? Otherwise a great car, clean and in excellent condition.

We cannot justify spending more money on this car.

How did you come to that conclusion?

_________________
2005 Liberty CRD Limited
DIY Garage Remanufactured Engine with GDE Full Torque Eco Tune from mile zero.
ARP Studs
Cummins Lift Pump
Transgo HD2 Reprogramming Kit
DIY Rebuilt Tranny Pump
Suncoast Torque Converter
2nd Generation Fuel Head
Sears P1 Battery
Hot Diesel Solutions Thermostat

An experienced diesel mechanic looked at it and said, "it isn'the an injector, it isn't a valve or rocker. It is coming from the crankcase, probably a cracked piston.

please remove injectors and test them in fuel shop ,, i had this problem hope this helps

reman bosch injector 0 445 110 217

OK. Good luck. I'd be interested in buying the engine.

_________________
2005 Liberty CRD Limited
DIY Garage Remanufactured Engine with GDE Full Torque Eco Tune from mile zero.
ARP Studs
Cummins Lift Pump
Transgo HD2 Reprogramming Kit
DIY Rebuilt Tranny Pump
Suncoast Torque Converter
2nd Generation Fuel Head
Sears P1 Battery
Hot Diesel Solutions Thermostat

If the problem is piston/liner or rod, the vehicle value drops considerably. This engine can soak you for beyond 6k depending on where the problem is. Or it can be less than 1k if constrained to the top end. If you do a tear down of the head it will help with determining the residual value.

_________________
Providers of wholly developed aftermarket solutions for the KJ CRD.
(248) 977 - 9531

I'd be curious about the experience this mechanic has with the CRD specifically. The reactions from other diesel mechanics has been somewhat universal on opening them up - "Wow, never seen anything like this before" features in the conversations.

You are talking about a $5000 mistake if he is wrong, and you give it away for nothing. It is worth the time to just disassemble the top end and see. Even if you decide to get rid of it at that point, I or anyone else who is actually experienced with these would be able to put it back together from bags of parts.

_________________
Proud supporting vendor of LOST Jeeps
TRAVELING CRD TECH. I come to you!
Need help? Just ask! I've taken it apart more than most.
Email jeep [at] maincomputer [dot] com - BOARD MESSAGING IS BROKEN
Over 225 CRDs currently driving with my valves, timing belt, rockers, or ARP Studs.
Bad noises = REALLY bad things.

If I have him remove the head and we verify the problem to be in the lower end, what would you be able to do to help?

Its certainly a tough question.

Surely the engine is broken. But you cant know exactly what is or what the cost of fixing it will be until you start taking the engine apart.

So you can either commit to fixing it at ??? cost.
Or you can sell it at a price much lower than you would like.

_________________
U.S. Army Retired

i agree with Geordi , how your mechanic can diagnose this problem ,,without removing top end , or at least remove injectors and push screwdriver down to see if piston is there or in the oil pan? If the piston is broken , engine won't run it will be seized the rod will come out through the side of the block , your engine is steel alive and turning starting , not mixing oil and coolant , i think it will be worth it to look at it from the top of the engine first, rather than looking from the bottom.