2006 CRD with 200,000 says belt never changed

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:49 pm

Guys. My place of employment has up for bids a 2006 crd limited with cloth seats that has close to 200,000 miles on it based on what the Mechanics in our vehicle shop told me. Speedo quit at 177000. It's on it's third turbo and its less than 8 months old. And probably less than 10,000 miles on it and they say its leaking oil. It's had good service as far as routine maintenance as far as oil changes and fluids. Its run stock since day one and has only had bio diesel blended fuel run thru it. I work at a biodiesel manufacture plant. It's up for bids and knowing what will need to be done to it. I was wondering what you guys thought the thing would be worth bidding on. It's a fleet vehicle so its had multiple drivers. The interior is good and paint shows a little wear. It's white in color so it hides a lot. Body good and straight with new tires. I just not sure what to bid for it. I have two 05 and was thinking of parts from this maybe later on. It runs but just needs some TLC on maintenance items. Any thoughts would be welcome. Tomorrow is place bid day.
JEB.

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papaindigo · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 2:20 pm

IMHO the chances of it making 200,000 miles on the original belt are virtually but not completely non-existant and if I was to bid on it I'd flat bed or tow it to a place to work on changing out the belt; being afraid cranking it up will be last straw for the TB. When you say "it's leaking oil" can I assume they think the turbo is leaking oil? Is so where? For example oil dripping on the ground from the vicinity of the turbo is more likely the turbo/air box hose is shot. If you are allowed to check the turbo impeller fan (front where CAC hose attaches it should have just a bit of fore/aft play and essentially no or barely perceptible side to side play). Any clue why they replaced the other turbos?

Does it run strong - e.g. good throttle response?

Speedo problem sounds like sensor but I'm not sure where

If you already have 2 and know the vehicles maybe see if you can get it for say $3,500-4,500 and figure you stole it if it just needs a TB job and routine stuff or that you got out ok if you have to throw in rockers and ARP studs and such.

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:11 pm

That bid might be at the top of the range - for that mileage and obviously in need of work (that they may think is more severe than it really is) I'd start bidding at $1200 and walk up from there.

Is this an open auction or silent auction, or a closed auction where you have no idea what the other bids are - if any? I really hope it isn't a closed auction, those suck for buyers.

As for the CRD... I'm with Papaindigo, the chances of this thing surviving with the original belt to 200k miles are S.L.I.M. and I certainly wouldn't want to drive it ANYWHERE before changing that belt out. I'd need to know more about the oil leak - where is it coming from / where is it visible on the engine - before I could make a determination about good or bad on that. The turbo replacements are more likely due to inexperienced mechanics looking at this and thinking that oil in the front of the turbo is bad, when that is actually from the CCV system and is completely normal on this vehicle and not hazardous at all. If this is completely stock, plan on doing the studs, intake elbow, drowning the main gallery of the intake in diesel to clean it of the goop, and then some form of an engine tune to get everything cleaned up and keep it clean.

Start low and work up - it isn't going to be on the high end of the KBB value when it needs at least $2500 worth of parts and labor at retail prices. Doesn't matter if you are the one doing the labor, the cost is still the same, and should come right off the potential value.

flman · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:12 pm

No more then $3000.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:58 pm

I don't disagree with either geordi or flman. The $s I suggested were on the assumption that you could get a look at the turbo impeller at least and that it was a "closed" auction (e.g. closed bids and high one wins). We know it runs and has been running on bio so it's not a non-running basket case. If it's a "closed" auction I might toss a $3-3.5K bid in as a not unreasonable $ amount knowing it needs a TB job (idparts kit) and might need rockers/ARP studs. If JEBCRD can handle the work parts; including brakes, battery, suspension and such; might be well under $1K or $2.5K at worst.

On the other hand if it's open bid starting at $1-1.2K is reasonable and see where it goes from there.

Wish we knew if anyone bidding actually knows the vehicle.

JEBCRD - if you can get to it cold; pop the coolant tank cap, put it back on, run for 15 seconds or so; pop coolant tank cap again (if no pressure head gasket is likely good but if pressure head will need to come off), put cap back on. Of course if you "say" it has pressure that might scare some folks not that I'm suggesting anything.

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:14 pm

About the timing belt. I've asked the Forman, the head mechanic which both say its not been changed. For the last two years I've warned them about it and I pretty much get the same response "we know but management says run it till it breaks. I couldn't believe it. The turbo I'm not sure what or where on the oil leak. I'm guessing like was suggested, one of the mechanics saw oil and thought oh well another turbo. Because he also said it started and seemed to run just fine. The only thing that concerns me is the mileage and something happening to the lower end. All the egr crap and time belt I can take care of. And with that cost being Immediately I wasn't thinking of much over 1500. Oh and even the mechanics are telling folks about the TB and suggesting not driving it but pick up in trailer. It is a closed bid type too. I'd like to get it but don't wont to over bid. I'm afraid some folks will, and they not knowing about these rigs.

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JEBCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:30 pm

It's funny what the guys told me today about trying to trade it in to the dealer. The dealer didn't even want it. I think that's funny. They have all the service records on it and none state the timing belt. This must be a record or something. The speedo stopped at 177,000 and that was almost a year ago one guy told me. That's why it's guessed to have almost 200,000 on it.

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geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:44 pm

Closed bids SUCK.

Knowing now everything you just said and what you posted before... I'd be comfortable bidding $2000 - $3000 and hope that everyone else is scared by the timing belt job. Tell everyone that it is a $1600 job at the dealership, but that not even the dealer wanted the thing back. Both are true statements so you aren't fibbing to anyone, but they also paint a less-than-kind image in the inexperienced mind about these. That can work in your favor.

With regard to the bottom end - I don't believe that is an issue unless they were not changing the oil properly or were using improper additives. I now believe that the second engine failure I had was more due to an oil additive than anything else. I had been running Rislone zinc additive for several changes at that time, and what I have come to realize since is this: Rislone also manufactures a motor flush product that they also sell in an ugly yellow bottle. It is entirely possible that I grabbed the wrong bottle by mistake and was driving around with that in the engine instead of oil and the zinc additive.
I can't say with 100% certainty that is what happened, but it fits all the circumstances.

Moral of the story: NOTHING BUT OIL INTO THE OIL. Other than that - I haven't heard of more than a couple bottom issues, so I tend to think that thankfully - those problems are beyond rare.

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 5:00 pm

Yes closed bids suck. Most folks here know I own two of them and have been telling just that. The cost is high to maintain, dealers are scared of them. Leading them to believe I'm not touching it too. There is one guy that has been asking the mechanics a lot of questions about it and I was told they pretty much told him you don't want it. Cost too high for repair. One even told him I wasn't even interested in it. I just laughed inside. I may put a 2000 bid in and see. It at least has 800 worth of tires on it. They are new.

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Srytrucker · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 10:02 pm

2000-3000 for the Jeep , get all parts for 3000, if you can work on it it will be a fun ride for 6 k, otherwise another couple of grand gets you resident Jeep whisper Geordi and you will still end up with killer ride.
If you are not interested just buy for 2K and flip it here or on ebay for a nice little profit, Good Luck.

geordi · **Posted:** Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:31 pm

Lol, thanks for the confidence! I wish you good luck tomorrow on the bidding.

Meanwhile, I have two CRDs sitting outside right now that I need to "whisper to" and see what ails them. One has an engine tapping that may or may not be poor combustion from bad rockers or just air in the fuel rail. The other one hasn't run in 2 years and according to the owner, drove for about 100 miles after a timing belt job and then just "stopped on the highway" I strongly suspect rockers on that one too.

Oh, and it is about 25 degrees cooler than the surface of the sun outside in Savannah right now. Toasty.

dirtmover · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:47 am

JEBCRD wrote:

For the last two years I've warned them about it and I pretty much get the same response "we know but management says run it till it breaks. I couldn't believe it.

So it's fairly clear that they place little value on this vehicle and are ultimately prepared to receive scrap value for it. I'd offer a price based on that plus a bit for what parts you think you can take from it. Probably somewhere around $1.5K.

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:12 am

I just asked one if the mechanics about the turbo and he said the leak looks to be coming around the shaft area. He also described the hose to turbo as looks swelled. Which I would expect. He also said it is still running good. And the engine sounded good. He also commented that it only used little oil between changes. Bids over at noon. Today.

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flash7210 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 9:39 am

These two statements dont add up:

JEBCRD wrote:

I just asked one if the mechanics about the turbo and he said the leak looks to be coming around the shaft area.

Quote:

He also commented that it only used little oil between changes.

If the turbo was actually bad, it would be using a lot of oil between oil changes.

I suspect its just normal oil inhalation from the CCV.
Install a Provent.

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:43 am

Apparently the oil leak has just started on the turbo. The mechanic said he pulled the hose and say oil was all in the hose and diagnosed it to be the turbo again. It's on it's third one so management said sale instead of fixing. Started it up and it sounds ok but rev it up and black smoke boils out thick. I can't tell if one of the hoses are busted though. I'm thinking it might be. The mechanic said see the turbo is putting oil in the engine. I just hmmm! Might be. But I'm thinking a hose or cooler leak.

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papaindigo · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 12:14 pm

So if I'm reading this right they have been replacing turbos based on diagnosing a bad turbo based on oil in the CAC hoses??? Sigh. Since vehicles were first fitted with PCV/CCV valves way back in 1964 (earlier in a few states) all those vehicles have had oil in the intake system and one guess where it's usually coming from. Sigh.

Black smoke can be several things other than a bad turbo. If you get it don't forget this possibility - viewtopic.php?f=5&t=70602&p=757348&hilit=boost+solenoid#p757348

geordi · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 3:08 pm

On a stock engine - count on the MAP sensor being covered in crap too.

JEBCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:08 pm

geordi wrote:

On a stock engine - count on the MAP sensor being covered in crap too.

Yes I was thinking the same thing.

Although, the auction ended with me not getting it. I actually bid 2777.00 and was told I didn't even come close, like around 7th. I asked what it went for in email and got no response. I'm just curious how high it went. I found out it was open to local car dealers which I think is a slap in the employees faces allowing local businesses to compete. If anything it should be a benefit to us at the plant if we were to get a vehicle at a decent price. I'm not for sure if a dealer got it but I hope they don't pawn it off on someone un aware of what they would be getting. I'm disappointed to say the least. I thought I may have made a mistake bidding that high based on what I knew about the jeep. O'l well I've got two more to spend my time with and they are little dandy's.

And guys for a fact this rig had 177000on the clock when the OD quit working and an estimate of another 10-15000 miles on top of that, with the original timing belt. I would not be so lucky. This must be a record for one.
I think I'll find the dealer that bought it and test drive it a little and see how long it last. Hehehe!

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geordi · **Posted:** Thu Jun 25, 2015 8:21 pm

If they let dealerships into the bidding, then those idiots probably bid at market black book rate for the thing and you never had a chance. Black book tends to run about 2k below blue book numbers, so somewhere in the 5k range. Some poor unsuspecting sucker is about to end up with a HUGE MESS.

Do you have the vin number? It might be handy to keep that available for anyone new that shows up on the forum in your region and ask - "gee, where'd ya get your new CRD?" and try to trace it back. At least you can give them the full history of the thing... Not that they would be happy about how badly they will have just taken a bath.

Srytrucker · **Posted:** Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:43 am

Hi Geordi this is exactly the frustration i have with these pesky auto dealers they demand sky high prices for a used CRD. these cars were sold brand new for 35K ,used good condition should be about 10K with all the fixes in it already, otherwise as a project not more than 5K as one has to sink at least 5k to make it dependable ride.

2006 CRD with 200,000 says belt never changed

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