CEL question

PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

layback40 wrote:

WWDiesel wrote:

My66dodge wrote:

The only thing that will turn on the check engine light is emissions related items, all other events will set a code but not turn on the light. That’s why on a regular basis at my shop someone will come in and say the cel just came on but have MANY codes stored from prior.

I thought there were some non-emission DTC's like security faults that would still illuminate a MIL?

I agree WW ! There are plenty of codes that are not emission related that will cause the check engine light. Start with transmission codes.

Any "P" dtc ( powertrain ) are emission related. So transmission codes are emission related.

"B"Body, "C"chassis and "U"network dtc usually are not but can also be in some cases !!!

My66dodge · **Posted:** Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:36 pm

If the transmission is slipping this will lead to a loss of fuel mileage thus anything transmission related is an emissions code!

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My66dodge · **Posted:** Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:37 pm

There are two base protocols built into every vehicle number one don’t damage the catalytic converter and number two don’t strand the customer.

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layback40 · **Posted:** Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:36 pm

My66dodge wrote:

If the transmission is slipping this will lead to a loss of fuel mileage thus anything transmission related is an emissions code!

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You are splitting hairs! Under certain conditions a bad earth can cause a code for high trans fluid temp. Its a false code, has no effect on fuel consumption.
Your suggestion sounds like a greenie. Blame everything on emissions!

flash7210 · **Posted:** Fri Apr 10, 2020 9:22 pm

My66dodge wrote:

There are two base protocols built into every vehicle number one don’t damage the catalytic converter and number two don’t strand the customer.

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There are always exceptions...

P2294
If you get that code engine will shut off and engine won’t restart.

How about we just agree that P code = Powertrain and leave it at that.

My66dodge · **Posted:** Fri Apr 10, 2020 9:47 pm

layback40 wrote:

My66dodge wrote:

If the transmission is slipping this will lead to a loss of fuel mileage thus anything transmission related is an emissions code!

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You are splitting hairs! Under certain conditions a bad earth can cause a code for high trans fluid temp. Its a false code, has no effect on fuel consumption.
Your suggestion sounds like a greenie. Blame everything on emissions!

I am just a PROFESSIONAL mechanic and have been doing this for a long time... I just understand how it works, NOTHING is really about the mpg, it’s all about the tail pipe emissions. Look at the “lifetime” fluid in most modern transmissions and the extreme oil service intervals... all driven by emissions... the mfgs pay taxes based on the emissions and that includes the waste fluids produced... once you understand how it works you will get it. Mfgs have limits they can work within, like when a Ford has a misfire they shut off the injector and it’s just pumping air with that cyl, they set their misfire counter VERY high (180k continuous) to turn on the MIL... that’s why fords don’t set the MIL as often as all other mfgs. Take the spark plug out of a Ford and drive it a few blocks and you will see it doesn’t pop the MIL, cause they don’t want to turn on the MIL, it’s a strategy to sell vehicles... I am the opposite of a greenie... I just understand how the system works... like the planned obsolescence... cars have to break and they have to sell and make more...look at all the discontinued parts for our Jeep for instance... and the manual trannys for the good older tdi’s, and he plastic parts for MANY cars that kills them...

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PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

My66dodge wrote:

layback40 wrote:

My66dodge wrote:

If the transmission is slipping this will lead to a loss of fuel mileage thus anything transmission related is an emissions code!

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You are splitting hairs! Under certain conditions a bad earth can cause a code for high trans fluid temp. Its a false code, has no effect on fuel consumption.
Your suggestion sounds like a greenie. Blame everything on emissions!

I am just a PROFESSIONAL mechanic and have been doing this for a long time... I just understand how it works, NOTHING is really about the mpg, it’s all about the tail pipe emissions. Look at the “lifetime” fluid in most modern transmissions and the extreme oil service intervals... all driven by emissions... the mfgs pay taxes based on the emissions and that includes the waste fluids produced... once you understand how it works you will get it. Mfgs have limits they can work within, like when a Ford has a misfire they shut off the injector and it’s just pumping air with that cyl, they set their misfire counter VERY high (180k continuous) to turn on the MIL... that’s why fords don’t set the MIL as often as all other mfgs. Take the spark plug out of a Ford and drive it a few blocks and you will see it doesn’t pop the MIL, cause they don’t want to turn on the MIL, it’s a strategy to sell vehicles... I am the opposite of a greenie... I just understand how the system works... like the planned obsolescence... cars have to break and they have to sell and make more...look at all the discontinued parts for our Jeep for instance... and the manual trannys for the good older tdi’s, and he plastic parts for MANY cars that kills them...

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Lots of fun to diagnose a misfire on a ford when your scanner doesn't even record any...….

Don't let the keyboard commando work you up like that...….. :SOMBRERO:

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sat Apr 11, 2020 4:37 pm

PZKW108 wrote:

Lots of fun to diagnose a misfire on a ford when your scanner doesn't even record any...….
Don't let the keyboard commando work you up like that...….. :SOMBRERO:

Another darn good reason not to own or work on a Ford! :banghead:

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:39 pm

With the Ford misfire question.... what scan tool do you use?

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PZKW108 · **Joined:** Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:23 pm **Posts:** 461

My66dodge wrote:

With the Ford misfire question.... what scan tool do you use?

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Solus

My66dodge · **Posted:** Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:39 am

A little help for you, Use the scan data and look at the misfire history if it has it depending on year, or use mode 6 under obd2 for misfire data it is almost always there. Use this the scan data for the long term fuel trim to determine which bank is misfiring, and to determine if it is rich or lean. If the LTFT is within +-5 its normal when fully warmed up, after its warmed up if its outside that rang it is starting to indicate a problem, if it’s +13 for example the engine is running lean and it’s commanding more fuel, if it’s -15 it’s taking away fuel. The baro depends on altitude, since I am at sea level it needs to be at 158hz nut 150-160 is ok. A lot of times on fords the MAF will go astray and the BARO will get out of wack and this will lean the crap out of the engine... a few weeks back I had one that was at 128hz, that is over 15000ft above sea level and so the computer was leaning the crap out of it... also look at the MAF reading at idle fully warmed up, it should be 1 to 1.2 times the displacement, so a 3.0L engine should read 3 - 3.6 G/S at idle, any Lowe indicates a vacuum or egg leak, any higher and the MAF is starting to fail or is dirty. Generally when the MAF gets dirty and starts to read high you can clean it and it will read better but the damage to the resistor is already done, get an OEM MAF only as the cardone ones oreilleys and others sell is complete crap and they fail out of the box.

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