Total Incompetence

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 6:41 pm

Took my KJ in for it's 30K service and LBJ replacement yesterday. They did all that I requested and it seemed fine afterwards, and only set me back $200.00 :shock:

. Today, I took it to my local mechanic so that he and I could put on the gas tank skid plate, which required removing the hitch, putting the plate up and reinstalling the hitch, something almost impossible by ones self at ground level. Anyway, while we got it up on the lift, I give it a good eyeball, including the LBJ's, and what do I find? A leaking front differential seal! These idiots supposedly did a "20 Point Inspection", including "Inspect Drive Train for any Fluid Leakage", which got an "OK" on the check list. We decided that we'd better check the fluid level in case, and upon inspection of the plug, notice that it hasn't been touched in sometime. They obviously don't check the fluid level in these when doing their "20 Point Inspection", which in a 4X4, you'd think would be a no-brainer. I just called the Service Writer, but only got a voice mail, but from my general demeanor :twisted:

, I'm not sure she wants to call me back. Now I've got to decide upon whether I get the seal fixed before my vacation next week, or let it go and do it when I return. I don't plan on doing too much 4X4ing during the trip, think it will be OK?

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:17 pm

Tell me about it... I got mine back from service last week & when I got home I found that the latches on the airbox were unclipped and the cover was just sittin on top, not even seated onto the air box.

JJsTJ · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:27 pm

Did you check the fluid level? Is it Ok? How bad is it leaking? If it is a minor leak and your level is fine I wouldn't worry about it too much but JIC, take a Qt. of gear oil w/ you on your trip and if you notice it leaking worse, top it off. Be sure to have a pump for the lube too.
I have way worse horror stories about my delaer including Not replacing LBJ's when they said they did. Oh well, No more Stealer for me on Anything at least not Hunter Dodge/Jeep.

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:04 pm

JJsKJ wrote:

Did you check the fluid level? Is it Ok? How bad is it leaking?

The fluid level is OK, very near the top, so the leak can't be too bad. The area around the drive shaft was wet and a small drip was hanging off the bottom of the differential case where the shaft enters. It's not pouring out, but it was VERY noticeable, which is why I'm so pissed.

The Service Manager called me and apologized, but offered no other explanation of why it was missed. The most he'll do is spring for a free rental car while mines being repaired. I was going to take it back tomorrow, but now, I'm thinking I'll just wait until I get back. It's not like they're around the corner. My closest dealer, Poway Jeep, where the work was (wasn't) done, is a 35 mile drive and 4000' elevation change, to get to. I'll just try and keep it out of 4WD and take it on the trip.

Jeger · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:10 pm

It doesnt matter whether you are in 4 wheel or not, everything up there will be spinning anyhow i think, would build up more heat in 4wd though. Just dont let the fluid get low.

JJsTJ · **Posted:** Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:05 pm

Jeger wrote:

It doesnt matter whether you are in 4 wheel or not, everything up there will be spinning anyhow i think, would build up more heat in 4wd though. Just dont let the fluid get low.

What he said. I would check the level at least once during your trip to be safe. Checking it and topping it off is quick and easy. Peace of mind!

It sounds like it is coming out of the pinion seal which is a PITA to change.

Elwenil · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 8:17 am

The "20 Point Inspection" deal is normally something Mopar does with it's advertising when it sends out all the coupons for oil changes like the recent "Free Front Wiper" deal. These are approved by the dealer and then sent out by Mopar. While some dealers do the inspections like they are supposed to, some mechanics work on flat rate and they try to move as much stuff through the shop as they can to make themselves more money and it is the mechanic that skips it normally. Either way it is the dealer's responsibility to correct the situation and see to it that it never happens again. I would recommend to anyone with an issue with their dealer, especially on a recall to contact the DCX customer service line and complain. That is the only way that DCX knows there is a problem and take it from me, they put a lot of pressure on the dealer to fix BS like this.

Guyute1210 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 1:20 pm

It looks like you have a 2005, so I would take it to them and make them replace it under warrenty...

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 1:26 pm

Guyute1210 wrote:

It looks like you have a 2005, so I would take it to them and make them replace it under warrenty...

It's still under warranty and they WILL fix it. My problem is, they had it over night, why didn't they fix it when they had it? They SHOULD have seen the problem, it was VERY obvious. Now I have to burn a half a tank of gas to take it back to them. What a pain.

alljeep · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:05 pm

Starcrwzr wrote:

The fluid level is OK, very near the top, so the leak can't be too bad. The area around the drive shaft was wet and a small drip was hanging off the bottom of the differential case where the shaft enters.

If you read the factory service manual or just a basic user manual, the level is supposed to be near the top, not at the top (I think it's either a half inch or a full inch below the fill plug opening). Your level sounds like it's full.

The seals, in general, are going to be moist and leak a drop every now and then. Just a few drops can spread over the case and driveshaft and make it look very large when in fact it's not.

From the description you have given, without having seen it, you do not have what would be considered a warrantable, or repair required, leak.

SD-KJ · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:20 pm

Starcrwzr,

I have this same problem and i have just left mine (however i am out of warranty). See this thread on mine, with pictures i think....

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... highlight=

I would not worry about it, like was said keep on top of your fluid level.

I talked w/ a service tech about the replacement of them and they said that if its not leaking bad like really draining fluid then i would not worry about it much. He said they had problems with them and even when a new one was put it he's seen them leak too.

my .02$

-Nick

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 4:57 pm

Quote:

I talked w/ a service tech about the replacement of them and they said that if its not leaking bad like really draining fluid then i would not worry about it much.

Quote:

The seals, in general, are going to be moist and leak a drop every now and then. Just a few drops can spread over the case and driveshaft and make it look very large when in fact it's not.

From the description you have given, without having seen it, you do not have what would be considered a warrantable, or repair required, leak.

Man, It's amazing what we'll put up with!! :shock:

A seal is supposed to do just that, seal! If it's "wet" or leaking at all, it's bad! They should not be "moist" and I'm amazed that anyone would stand for letting a dlr say "that if its not leaking bad like really draining fluid then i would not worry about it much."

If it's leaking at all, make em replace it. Period. That's what a warranty is for. If it was a $100k Mercedes would you be happy with that explanation? So why should you accept it on your $30 KJ? :roll:

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:07 pm

SD-KJ wrote:

Starcrwzr,

I have this same problem and i have just left mine (however i am out of warranty). See this thread on mine, with pictures i think....

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... highlight=

I would not worry about it, like was said keep on top of your fluid level.

I talked w/ a service tech about the replacement of them and they said that if its not leaking bad like really draining fluid then i would not worry about it much. He said they had problems with them and even when a new one was put it he's seen them leak too.

my .02$

-Nick

Thanks for the pictures. My leak is probably a little worse then yours, or at least, gone longer without a fix. The oil has spread back over the universal joint housing and along the drive shaft somewhat. There's also oil that's been flung up on the chassis members as well. Here's a picture of the leak...

NU ARTY BOY · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:51 pm

Yea, ummm......get that fixed.

JJsTJ · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:53 pm

That needs to be fixed. I have two KJ's and Neither of them looks like that at all, both are dry. I wouldn't want them to look anything like that either. Sucks that you have to travel to get it fixed but do it.

After about 10 yrs and 100K miles it is Ok for a Jeep to leak, as they are just marking their territory then. :wink:

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 8:07 pm

OK, you convinced me, I'm taking it to the dealer tomorrow. I can just get it down there and get back before our guests arrive. They said they'd give me a rental, no charge, so I can get back home. Thanks for all of your input everyone!

LostRenegade · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 8:59 pm

When I took my KJ in for the recall, the dealer called me and tried to sell me their 4x4 driveline service. He said that I needed the transfer case fluid and differential gear lube. He said that the gear lube was black. It told him that I would take care of it myself.

Well I changed the fluids the other day. The transfer case needed changing, but the differentials were fine.
Even though this dealer took real good care of me, they tried to sell me extra service. Probably to try and offset the cost of the recall.

Starcrwzr · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 9:16 pm

I know what you mean! When I first called for the 30K service and LBJ fix, I asked what it would cost, and they said $600.00! :shock:

I asked what that was for, and they gave me this long list of fluid replacements, including coolant. Well I said I only wanted what the manual states is necessary, tire rotation, oil change, spark plugs, check fluids. On the way down there, I started thinking about the coolant and our upcoming trip to Death Valley, and thought, "What the heck, I'll that done too." When I talked to service writer, not the one I usually deal with, he said the coolant is a long life type and should be good till 60K. I didn't say anything, but said fine, I'll wait until 60k. I then turned around and looked at their "Recommended" 30K service list, and right there on the wall, it said "Replace coolant", wish they'd make up their minds! Stealership for sure!

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Thu Sep 28, 2006 9:23 pm

My favorite is when I bring it in for service and they pull out the recomended services list, they always manage to pull up the "severe usage" list not the "normal usage" one. They used to do the same thing with my Camaro at Chevy.

SD-KJ · **Posted:** Fri Sep 29, 2006 1:03 am

Cacher123 wrote:

Man, It's amazing what we'll put up with!! :shock:

A seal is supposed to do just that, seal! If it's "wet" or leaking at all, it's bad! They should not be "moist" and I'm amazed that anyone would stand for letting a dlr say "that if its not leaking bad like really draining fluid then i would not worry about it much."

If it's leaking at all, make em replace it. Period. That's what a warranty is for. If it was a $100k Mercedes would you be happy with that explanation? So why should you accept it on your $30 KJ? :roll:

I agree with you completely, however when I brought it in to have it looked at it was only under the 7/70000 warranty with the deductable. and they were going to charge like 200-300 dollars to get it fixed and i really didnt want to spend that at the time. I took their advice and i am just watching it. I will most likely have it changed to do it my self at some point in time.

Total Incompetence

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