The EGR failure research thread

Jeger · **Posted:** Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:25 am

This was started in one thread, then it was mentioned in another thread that perhaps the infomation should be in it OWN thread, so here it is.

This what we got started already, if anyone I have quoted needs to change anything post up your changes and let me know so I can delete your quoted info. If anyone else that posts need to update, just edit your original post so that we wont have double entries.
What we were looking at is

Mileage
# EGR's replaced or Flow control valve if applicable
Driving conditions, higway, city, idle time etc.
Fuel, fuel additives, and anything else you might think is related.

BCool wrote:

This is the fifth thread for this but hopefully we'll see a pattern this time

34,000
0 Still on Orig with both
Lots of trips to Utah and California, Steep grades high speed about 50 percent pulling (~1500lbs) at 75-83mph, stop lights and traffic,
work commute 10 miles total
B-20 and B-5 Once with B-99 and of course the occasional dino

I don't really drive that hard, occasionally I step on it, wot? (I never could figure out what that is an abbreviation for) I think the long high speed towing could burn them clean. But what do I know I'm a banker and have few mechanic skills. No provent, no ehm.

Ranger1 wrote:

24,300 miles - 1st egr at 8K - 2nd egr at 20K miles.
75% Interstate driving, 50 miles per day, 5 miles stop and go.
PS in every tank, lots of B20, good quality D2 from major brand stations.

The egr is shut off after 60 seconds of idle when the engine is fully warmed up. If idling quite a bit, it would take conditions that are less than 60 - 75 seconds in duration on average idle times. However, the amount of egr gas cycled would be highest at high speed, light load cruising conditions, as egr is off at WOT, acceleration and idle times over 60 seconds.

RFCRD wrote:

OK, for my numbers:
18,700 miles. Original EGR, drive it like it's stolen, 95% expressway & I don't idle more than absolutely necessary. Run a Provent and anal about keeping the oil cleaned out of the CAC. Try to keep @ b5-b20 mix as much as possible. Never had a CEL.

Jeger, if it throws a CEL on my way home, it's all your fault. :lol:

FarmDiesel · **Joined:** Thu Sep 15, 2005 8:49 am **Posts:** 132

39,600 currently.

1 EGR replaced at 14,000

Driving is 10% interstate, 20% suburban, 70% rural highway. Idle time is minimal, other than warmup and cool-down.

Fuel is either Citgo B20 or BP Amoco LSD fuel.

Equipped with Provent.

vtdog · **Joined:** Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:27 am **Posts:** 640

05 sport
34k at present
egr replacement @ 10k
70% hiway
5% city
20% 2 lane hiway 40-50mph
5% trail use/dirt road
no additives
b-20 on very very rare occasion
hess 45 cetane used most often (lsd)
ulsd being phased in last 30 days

cerich · **Posted:** Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:54 am

05 Limited June 05 build
25,400 miles
On orginal EGR
99% Highway at 70-80mph
No EHM or Provent
Had dealer use wrong oil (15w40) and too much of it the first 10-12K, it went thru oil badly immediatly after oil changes then stabilized, once figured out the dealer was putting in to much the oil consumption has stopped

Strangely the intercooler hose is clean....

DarbyWalters · **Posted:** Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:09 am

2006 CRD
6,100 miles
Regular Diesel (b20 twice)
PowerServe fuel additive
90% stop and go in Texas heat
EHM at 2,000 miles
Oil Changes every 3,000 for now

Original EGR...no warranty work so far

oldnavy · **Posted:** Mon Sep 25, 2006 11:12 am

Just back from the delership and they will be replacing both EGR & EGR FCV and doing a special TSB flash that is for the EGR. I will try to remember to charge up the camera battery tonight and take pictures. I asked about the coolant and he said they will just replace the factory coolant if it is not possible to clamp hoses off to prevent major loose of coolant. The tech says he can do both in about 2 hrs (done mine and 2 others he says and many of them on the Sprinter) and then what ever length of time the required for the TSB Flash. So my trip tomorrow for test run of CCV filter is put off again.

jaciii · **Joined:** Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:09 am **Posts:** 25

Had EGR replace at around 16K.

Going into the dealer with 36,600miles and the same symptoms today.

I'm gonna try to talk to them about the intake and the Intake Throttle Valve possibilities. Wish me luck.

DZL_LOU · **Posted:** Mon Sep 25, 2006 1:55 pm

oldnavy wrote:

Just back from the delership and they will be replacing both EGR & EGR FCV and doing a special TSB flash that is for the EGR. I will try to remember to charge up the camera battery tonight and take pictures. I asked about the coolant and he said they will just replace the factory coolant if it is not possible to clamp hoses off to prevent major loose of coolant. The tech says he can do both in about 2 hrs (done mine and 2 others he says and many of them on the Sprinter) and then what ever length of time the required for the TSB Flash. So my trip tomorrow for test run of CCV filter is put off again.

I'll be curious to see those pictures and the level of soot. Beg and plead to keep the parts!

DZL_LOU · **Posted:** Tue Sep 26, 2006 7:02 am

05 CRD limited purchased new Sept 05
28,000 miles
Original EGR Valve
Replaced Flow Control Valve at 25,000
90% Highway Driving 65-70 mph
BP Diesel Supreme Fuel
8~10 oz. of Power Service per tankful
Idle 2~3 minutes for cooldown before shutoff
Oil Changed every 5,000 miles.
Air filter changed every 8,000 miles
Fuel Water separator changed every 10,000 miles

naturist · **Posted:** Tue Sep 26, 2006 9:33 am

05 Sport purchased new Sept 05
1st EGR replaced at 4,000 miles w/ original design after software flash: check engine light back on less than 200 miles
2nd EGR replaced at 6,000 miles w/ updated design: check engine light back on less than 100 miles
FCV replaced on my dollar at 11,000 miles: now at 19,000 miles and seems to be fine.

Mostly B50, some tanks of straight petro, thus meaning low (<5%) blends.

At 11,000 miles, along with new FCV, added Provent and switched to 5w-40 Mobil 1 T&SUV oil. Have since drained perhaps a half-pint of oil from the Provent: saved a sample and returned rest to crankcase. Have seen no evidence of "schmutz" in oil captured by the Provent, line to intake from Provent remains clean.

KJMedic · **Posted:** Fri Sep 29, 2006 9:37 pm

'05 Sport
28000 miles
EGR #1 at 7,000 miles

EGR #2 and FCV at 14000 miles

EGR #3 at 21000 miles :cry:

EGR #4 at 26000 miles

Driving mostly on rural 2 lane roads at ~60-65mph.

some Power Service use in colder months.

Overall still love my CRD.

Laids · **Posted:** Fri Oct 06, 2006 7:41 pm

21,000 miles and original EGR, the engine light came on the other day so took it to the dealership right away.
Cause: Minimal EGR Flow Detected PO401
Correction: Deleted DTC, Road Tested Jeep, No DTCS Came Back. If Code Comes Back In Future, Replacing EGR Valve Recommended

The engine light came back on today, 2 days later.

My question for those many this has happened to is, because I havn't experienced any performance issues, how long before I do as I need the Liberty to get my boat at the cottage and bring it home about 120 miles each way?

Ranger1 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:40 pm **Posts:** 1137

Laids wrote:

21,000 miles and original EGR, the engine light came on the other day so took it to the dealership right away.
Cause: Minimal EGR Flow Detected PO401
Correction: Deleted DTC, Road Tested Jeep, No DTCS Came Back. If Code Comes Back In Future, Replacing EGR Valve Recommended

The engine light came back on today, 2 days later.

My question for those many this has happened to is, because I havn't experienced any performance issues, how long before I do as I need the Liberty to get my boat at the cottage and bring it home about 120 miles each way?

It depends on whether the valve failed in the open or closed position. Short answer, if it fails in open position, get fixed fast, for details see below. If it still runs good, you have a finite amount of time - but the valve could move open at any time and leave you with heavy black smoke, really poor performance, and glow plugs which will be stressed heavily, possibly to the point of failure. I wouldn't take it on a long road trip before fixing it, but that's just me. It depends on your tolerance for engine trouble while on the road.

If it fails in the closed position, you won't get heavy black smoke and your performance will be normal until the valve opens even slightly. If it fails in open position you will have some moderate to heavy black smoke, but not always enough to see in the rear view mirror.

If you keep running it without fixing it, your glow plugs may be overstressed and burn out as well, but most likely some time after your egr is replaced. Then another trip to the dealer, another CEL and more waiting in the visiting room.

You may get a week or 2 before problems start or just a couple of days. When my first egr failed, it failed open and caused heavy black smoke, loss of performance and also caused 2 gp's to be stressed - 3 days after the egr was replaced, the gp's went and another trip ensued, plus another return trip when the parts came in.

When my 2nd egr went out, it failed closed and no major performance issues for 2 weeks, as the dealership was booked. At 2 weeks, it had deterioted to the point where performance was starting to suffer and smoke was increasing.

Laids · **Posted:** Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:58 pm

Thanks; I don't think I will risk using it this weekend it. When I talked to the mechanic and parts guy I said 'order me a new EGR right now don't wait' as I know from this forum I will need it, they didn't argue. The quandry is that while you know that certain failures with the CRD will occur at some point (as evidensed by other owners) you know it is usually under warranty and hope if it happens again is still under that period (glad I got it extended) but what about after warranty. EGR, Transmission..., and I hope that my diligent cooling period before shutdown gives some extra life to the Turbo, and if it does pack it in, is still under warranty.

BiodieselJeep.com · **Posted:** Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:58 pm

oldnavy wrote:

Just back from the delership and they will be replacing both EGR & EGR FCV and doing a special TSB flash that is for the EGR.

What TSB flash for the EGR? Can yo get the number? Will it finally turn the darn thing off?

bugnout · **Posted:** Mon Oct 09, 2006 3:25 pm

24k on my 2005
EGR was replaced at about 20k, did EHM after EGR was replaced
No Biodiesel, PS in every tank - Run Mobil 1 0-40 until last oil change, now running Rotella 5-40 synthetic
commute 17 miles to work everyday, a dozen trips a year, 300 miles to the lake, about half of them towing a boat or trailer.
Follow cool down recommendations on the long trips which I typically drive straight through, but I can't say I'm as diligent on the daily drive, I ussually finish listening to the current song then shut down.

longarm · **Posted:** Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:51 pm

Milage 26,599. My EGR has been replaced three times now. I popped a check engine light today with same symptoms as before. KJ is spending the night at dealership. I will find out in the am if it's the EGR for a fourth time. I drive a mix of city and highway. Est. mileage for EGR replacement is 7K miles first replacement, 13K miles second replacement, 22K miles third replacement. Now, with 22599, poss. a fourth replacement. If thats the case, I'm going to tell the dealership to hold off and not replace it. I will right away cert. mail a letter to DCX informing them of a last chance to repair my vehicle. Thats in accordance with the Lemon Law in Michigan. I thought of just painting a HUGE lemon on the sides and hood with those washable markers and driving the 45 minuntes to DCX world HQ. I can park on the side of the road with the hood up on Featherstone and Opdyde Rd's. Thats the corner nearest DCX HQ and insaine high flow traffic area near two of Michigans busiest freeways. THAT ought to get some attention.

macd · **Joined:** Mon Sep 19, 2005 1:46 pm **Posts:** 50

05 CRD Limited

1st EGR @ 9000 miles
2nd EGR @ 17000 miles

Turbo replaced @ 15000 miles

My driving is all highway. This vehicle is the biggest piece of s$!% I've ever owned. It was in the shop over 50 days the first year I owned it.

I love the gas mileage and torque, but its a lemon as I think most of them are. I am done with Jeep, never again.

alljeep · **Posted:** Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:29 am

For the people having multiple failures (especially longarm) my local diesel tech here said that the PCM is supposed to be replaced as the programming is what is wrecking them(the EGRs).

To date, I'm only familiar with the ECM and the TCM so this is news to me and at best is just a rumor from a tech, but worth asking about.

I'm at 14,995 miles right now at 13 months of driving with no actual failures, just the dog gone transmission shudder that is most prevalent in the summer time. Now that it's cooled off it's gone, for now.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:13 am

alljeep wrote:

For the people having multiple failures (especially longarm) my local diesel tech here said that the PCM is supposed to be replaced as the programming is what is wrecking them(the EGRs).

To date, I'm only familiar with the ECM and the TCM so this is news to me and at best is just a rumor from a tech, but worth asking about.

I'm at 14,995 miles right now at 13 months of driving with no actual failures, just the dog gone transmission shudder that is most prevalent in the summer time. Now that it's cooled off it's gone, for now.

I can definately see the Airflow control valve failing if an owner does a lot of stop & go driving or is on & off the throttle frequently. The software parameters that control this valve are adjustable. It can be programmed so the valve doesn't move as often (thus lasts longer) and also not as sensitive to giving a CEL when there is a malfunction.

To date, I still have both my original EGR and airflow control valves at 20K miles. I also do @ 95% expressway driving in cruise control so these valves likely don't change position very often. I am with macd on this one, this is also the biggest piece of s$!% I've ever owned.

The EGR failure research thread

Who is online