Biodiesel

SLS · **Posted:** Sun Dec 13, 2009 1:16 am

Yes, I agree :!:

Biodiesel does belong with the Liberty CRDs, and whenever possible. as a fuel for the Jeep Liberty CRD. In fact I was looking for a diesel that I could fuel with biodiesel that would do everything I wanted and would be good in the winter that's why I bought the Jeep Liberty CRD.

mikey1273 · **Posted:** Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:21 am

I have been running the bio now for almost two weeks. I have had no issue with jelling and all. the truck starts up good with and with out the engine heater. when I started with it I splash mixed b50 in the tank. a few days later it got colder and I had used a 1/4 of that tank so I topped off with some petroD. that should have brought me down to about B25. On morning during our cold snap it was 15°F, I was worried but everything was ok. I have to go a bit out of my way to get the bio but I think I am going to get it when I can. I still have 5 gallons in my basment to use up

Randy B · **Posted:** Sun Dec 13, 2009 12:27 pm

I have looked into Bio and found a suppler within 20 miles, they have B-5 and also B-99. If i run the B-5 do i still need to use an additive ? . I also notice that some other supplers state they have a winter blend of B-10. Are there additives added, more for the winter? We do get some cold temps here in MD, Jeep is in the garage at nite but sits out during the day at work. Just trying to make a good move going to Bio and don't want to make jelly.

mikey1273 · **Posted:** Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:50 pm

I don't have much experince with diesel since this is my first one and I only just started with bio. I used some power service when I mixed the B50, I did not add more then I dilited it down to B25. if they say its winterixed I would ask how they do that then decide. being new to this I would add a few ounes to each tank to be safe. Since I use power service additve it has other functions as well as antijell, it helps lube and clean the fuel system or atleast the bottle says it does, both good things that can't hurt.

SLS · **Posted:** Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:05 pm

Last year I used "Cold Flow Improver" by Amsoil then swiched to the
"Diesel Concentrate Plus Cold Flow Improver" to help prevent gelling.

You don't really need an additive that lubes and clean the fuel system
which is what the "Diesel Concentrate" does. You don't need a cetane
booster either because biodiesel does all of this and more.

Biodiesel has a higher cetane number, compared diesel fuel (Cetane is
to diesel as Octane is to gasoline). Cetane number is a measure of a
fuel's ignition quality. The high cetane numbers of biodiesel contribute
to easy cold starting and low idle noise.

This year I'm keeping a bottle of "AMSOIL Diesel Recovery" in the
Jeep which quickly dissolves gelled fuel, thaws frozen fuel filters so
you shouldn't have to replace the filter. It's supose to performs well in
all diesel fuels, including ULSD, off-road and biodiesel. I'm hoping I
will not have to find out but just in case I have it with me.

RJM · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:57 am

You must have crappy diesel in the US if you need to add all the snake oil to it, if your using diesel that don't flow, don't use it. I live in one of the most severe climates in the world, never have, and never will put that paint thinner in my tank. Never had a fuel related problem, go figure! In fact with winter diesel I do all I can to boost lubricity, not thin it more. Independent testing shows that Amsoil Diesel Concentrate does very little in that regard.

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:44 pm

The correct answer is from the people that specialize in Diesel Fuel treatment, and trusted by thousands of truck drivers who LIVE or STARVE with their rigs:

POWER SERVICE.

White bottle for Winter

Silver bottle for Summer

Red 911 bottle for RJM's front yard.

UFO · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:02 pm

geordi wrote:

The correct answer is from the people that specialize in Diesel Fuel treatment, and trusted by thousands of truck drivers who LIVE or STARVE with their rigs:

POWER SERVICE.

White bottle for Winter

Silver bottle for Summer

Red 911 bottle for RJM's front yard.

But now with ULSD, the lubricity additive in this product is not particularly good, and winterized diesel needs even more. 2% biodiesel minimum is the most effective lubricity additive.

dgeist · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:16 pm

UFO wrote:

But now with ULSD, the lubricity additive in this product is not particularly good, and winterized diesel needs even more. 2% biodiesel minimum is the most effective lubricity additive.

If I could I would run B20 from Spring to fall then B2 in the winter (as suggested) but as I don't have a convenient B100 supplier other than the one I have to drive 20 miles to pump at and no place to (safely) store and mix, I fall back to ULSD and PS for the winter months. I use the ULSD to avoid gelling and the PS for lubricity. I don't think Georgia has been cold enough to justify the anti-gel in ULSD since the last ice age (maybe...).

Dan

UFO · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:02 pm

Ashless 2-stroke oil gives good lubricity as well.

RJM · **Posted:** Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:33 pm

UFO wrote:

Ashless 2-stroke oil gives good lubricity as well.

Lighting the fuse are you?

SLS · **Posted:** Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:32 am

geordi wrote:

The correct answer is from the people that specialize in Diesel Fuel treatment, and trusted by thousands of truck drivers who LIVE or STARVE with their rigs:

POWER SERVICE.

White bottle for Winter

Silver bottle for Summer

Red 911 bottle for RJM's front yard.

I was wondering who supplied all those truck stops.

Yes the US does have some crappy #2 dino diesel. There will be higher standards on biodiesel :!:

linewarbr · **Posted:** Tue Dec 15, 2009 10:20 am

SLS wrote:

Last year I used "Cold Flow Improver" by Amsoil then swiched to the
"Diesel Concentrate Plus Cold Flow Improver" to help prevent gelling.

You don't really need an additive that lubes and clean the fuel system
which is what the "Diesel Concentrate" does. You don't need a cetane
booster either because biodiesel does all of this and more.

Biodiesel has a higher cetane number, compared diesel fuel (Cetane is
to diesel as Octane is to gasoline). Cetane number is a measure of a
fuel's ignition quality. The high cetane numbers of biodiesel contribute
to easy cold starting and low idle noise.

This year I'm keeping a bottle of "AMSOIL Diesel Recovery" in the
Jeep which quickly dissolves gelled fuel, thaws frozen fuel filters so
you shouldn't have to replace the filter. It's supose to performs well in
all diesel fuels, including ULSD, off-road and biodiesel. I'm hoping I
will not have to find out but just in case I have it with me.

CETANE IS NOT THE EQUIVALENT OF OCTANE. OCTANE IS A MEASURE OF GASOLINE'S RESISTANCE TO AUTO-IGNITION, WHILE CETANE IS A MEASURE OF A FUEL OIL'S WILLINGNESS TO AUTO-IGNITE.

RJM · **Posted:** Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:43 am

linewarbr wrote:

SLS wrote:

Last year I used "Cold Flow Improver" by Amsoil then swiched to the
"Diesel Concentrate Plus Cold Flow Improver" to help prevent gelling.

You don't really need an additive that lubes and clean the fuel system
which is what the "Diesel Concentrate" does. You don't need a cetane
booster either because biodiesel does all of this and more.

Biodiesel has a higher cetane number, compared diesel fuel (Cetane is
to diesel as Octane is to gasoline). Cetane number is a measure of a
fuel's ignition quality. The high cetane numbers of biodiesel contribute
to easy cold starting and low idle noise.

This year I'm keeping a bottle of "AMSOIL Diesel Recovery" in the
Jeep which quickly dissolves gelled fuel, thaws frozen fuel filters so
you shouldn't have to replace the filter. It's supose to performs well in
all diesel fuels, including ULSD, off-road and biodiesel. I'm hoping I
will not have to find out but just in case I have it with me.

CETANE IS NOT THE EQUIVALENT OF OCTANE. OCTANE IS A MEASURE OF GASOLINE'S RESISTANCE TO AUTO-IGNITION, WHILE CETANE IS A MEASURE OF A FUEL OIL'S WILLINGNESS TO AUTO-IGNITE.

What I find interesting is there are products that claim to be suitable for both gasoline and diesel, people fall for it and dump the crap in there tanks! Man I am in the wrong business.

liberty2.8 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:26 pm

I got my first taste(well my Libby did) of Biodiesel today. I got it from an oil company that only has B99. Looked like I was pouring straight veggy oil in. Anyway, the temp here routinely approaches freezing overnight but warms up to 40's-50's during the day. Should I worry about gelling and get some Powerservice? If so, how much should I add? I am going to get another fuel filter today since my Libby has never seen Bio and I am expecting a lot of crud dissolving in the fuel system from using Bio from what I have heard and read. Anything else I should watch out for?

CRD Joe · **Posted:** Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:03 pm

You mentioned temps at freezing. YES you should be using some type of cold flow improver....

UFO · **Posted:** Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:35 pm

liberty2.8 wrote:

I got my first taste(well my Libby did) of Biodiesel today. I got it from an oil company that only has B99. Looked like I was pouring straight veggy oil in. Anyway, the temp here routinely approaches freezing overnight but warms up to 40's-50's during the day. Should I worry about gelling and get some Powerservice? If so, how much should I add? I am going to get another fuel filter today since my Libby has never seen Bio and I am expecting a lot of crud dissolving in the fuel system from using Bio from what I have heard and read. Anything else I should watch out for?

I would add at least 40% diesel #2 and mix well by driving 5 -10 miles before shutting down for the night.

liberty2.8 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 18, 2009 6:43 pm

Quote:

I would add at least 40% diesel #2 and mix well by driving 5 -10 miles before shutting down for the night.

I added PowerService at 16 oz. for 20 gal. That is the recommended amount for B20. I think this should be okay since it's not supposed to freeze tonight, what do you think?

RJM · **Posted:** Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:15 pm

liberty2.8 wrote:

Quote:

I would add at least 40% diesel #2 and mix well by driving 5 -10 miles before shutting down for the night.

I added PowerService at 16 oz. for 20 gal. That is the recommended amount for B20. I think this should be okay since it's not supposed to freeze tonight, what do you think?

You may want to look at the data sheet regarding PS, Make an informed choice based on the numbers, and not claims of PS.

geordi · **Posted:** Sat Dec 19, 2009 11:26 pm

Want to see what your tank looks like on the inside? Pour some of that B99 into a jar, add an appropriate percentage (it will be a VERY small amount) of Power Service and put it into the freezer overnight.

Set up another jar, but this time put in a FULL FIFTY PERCENT of regular diesel instead, so now instead of B99, you have B50. Put that into the freezer overnight as well.

$5 says that the B99 with power service alone will be a jar of yellow jello.

Power service is good stuff, but it is NOT effective in pure biodiesel against below-gel-point-temps. Also, winter and pure biodiesel are NOT a good combination, the fuel gels at too high a temperature.

You do not want the fuel in your tank to become jello. I would drive your truck over to the nearest diesel pump ASAP and put half the tank (10 gallons) of REGULAR DIESEL into it, then drive it around to mix that up before going home.
For temps less than 0 degrees F, use 80% regular fuel (16 gallons) and no more than 4 gallons of biodiesel in a full tank to keep it from becoming jello overnight.

Biodiesel

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