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 Post subject: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:28 pm 
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I'd bring this up in that forum, but I didn't feel comfortable doing that. I'm just wishing Bennett would have offered the site to someone already involved with it.

The new guy obviously bought it as a business and personally I think his ideas to make money are going to diminish the site. He came to me asking for $270 a year to be a "preferred vendor". Sounds reasonable, but its more than I can afford for such things. Effectively more than what I'd pay for hosting and domains for my own site. He also told me he won't continue letting non-preferred people post in the vendors alley because it wouldn't be fair to the preferred vendors.

I think it could still be worth being a preferred vendor for some, basically getting your own space to post, where you can mediate your own threads, etc, as opposed to little guys all just posting threads in a big mishmash of other peoples threads. Plus I'm guessing those people would get banner adds, but who knows, that might cost more.

He has every right to do what he wants, its his site now. I just think that there will essentially be harder for the community to find available products now, as little guys and oddball type things won't pay to become preferred.

I hope this site gets offered up to a member if they ever sell it off....

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:34 am 
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Good luck to our fellow Liberty site, Jeep KJ Country. I rarely went over there for a visit. Usually only when LOST was down. I 'd hate to see it go down because it became a business. It was a good enthusiast's places to hang out.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:41 am 
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i dont post there much but from what ive seen im not liking some of the changes myself. if it was in good order it should have been left that way, with maybe a few changes that forum members suggested. hopefully not a whole lot more changes. :5SHOTS:


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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:22 am 
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Boiler wrote:
I hope this site gets offered up to a member if they ever sell it off....


Going to sell it to TBJ.

:juggle:

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:27 am 
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Boiler,understand where you are coming from,believe this,when I get the funds you are the fellow I am buying from. Heck,piss on rules,jump in and post up,worst that will happen is he will ban you,then you become a folk hero like the one who remains unnamed.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:12 am 
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Actually, I was thinking instead of linking the vendor section over there with my signature, I could just link the vendor section here. Maybe help a few people find LOST too.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:36 am 
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Chip, I'm not too keen on the changes to JKJC either. Think I'll be spending a lot more time here. Don't worry about the Vendor crap. You've got a following already. Those willing to spend their cash on your gear will find you.

Ian

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:34 pm 
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JKJ is way down the pimp list from LOST, IMHO. I do not see that only allowing paid vendors to be vendors is a big deal: many succesful websites, including what is arguably the largest and most succesful 4x4 one, follow that same business plan. I have seen too many sites come and go for altruistic reasons and I don't mind one I enjoy getting more commercial if it keeps it going. LOST is trying to be more inclusive. As the Liberty road may be a dead end, and if it is to survive..such change may be necessary.

No one asks any of us to play in their sandboxes: we came on our own. There has already been one new site created. Instead of finding ways to cheat the new JKJ owner, maybe folks could take that cue and set up their own sites? It is even "cheaper."

It takes money to make money. Seeing the number of members on this site alone who have been boned from fly by night operations, I can see taking steps to assure vendors are legit is a good safety precaution, as well. It may hurt some legit small operators but if it protects some of us from being ripped off...

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:06 pm 
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That might not be so bad, Boiler. I say that because you don't necessarily have to incur the cost. I don't know how many products you would sell on an annual basis, but the type of products you fabricate are not necessarily pocket change so bumping your prices a little would easily dissolve that $270. I guess your business increase from advertising there, if any, is not quantifiable now, but you might find that you might not even need to increase your prices.

I don't think anyone will be happy to pay a higher price, but a $10 or $20 increase will not turn them off from a product that costs $1,000 + shipping. You are running a business so I don't see why anyone should it take personal.


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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 5:24 pm 
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It takes money to make moeny, and when it comes to advertising, I paraphrase:

A business with no sign is a sign of no business.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 6:29 pm 
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You can post bad words on JKJC though...

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:41 pm 
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InCommando wrote:
It takes money to make moeny, and when it comes to advertising, I paraphrase:

A business with no sign is a sign of no business.



Exactly what business are they in? :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 12:00 am 
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How much does it cost to be a preferred vendor here?

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 2:46 am 
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Boiler wrote:
I'd bring this up in that forum, but I didn't feel comfortable doing that. I'm just wishing Bennett would have offered the site to someone already involved with it.

The new guy obviously bought it as a business and personally I think his ideas to make money are going to diminish the site. He came to me asking for $270 a year to be a "preferred vendor". Sounds reasonable, but its more than I can afford for such things. Effectively more than what I'd pay for hosting and domains for my own site. He also told me he won't continue letting non-preferred people post in the vendors alley because it wouldn't be fair to the preferred vendors.

I think it could still be worth being a preferred vendor for some, basically getting your own space to post, where you can mediate your own threads, etc, as opposed to little guys all just posting threads in a big mishmash of other peoples threads. Plus I'm guessing those people would get banner adds, but who knows, that might cost more.

He has every right to do what he wants, its his site now. I just think that there will essentially be harder for the community to find available products now, as little guys and oddball type things won't pay to become preferred.

I hope this site gets offered up to a member if they ever sell it off....


I never forced you to pay $270. There are options, and the $270 is for the year. You can pay $30/month or even $60/3 months. Thats nothing if you sell a few parts a month. With the setup I have, like you said, its your own section, your own site really. I also mass email the users to show off your sales every now and then.

If you don't have a site, you of course have to get one made(at least $xxx if not more), host it(at least $10/month) and then advertise it($xx-$xxx/month). If you are paying only $30/month, thats pretty dang cheap for the amount of exposure you have on JKJ. I am taking a guess here, but you probably made more then $30 a month off the the old vendor alley section. With the newsetup, with alot more exposure, what makes you think you wouldn't sell even more?

I am not a business and JeepKj.com is not apart of an enterprise. This is my hobby and the stuff I love, forums and autos!

yellocoyote wrote:
Boiler wrote:
Actually, I was thinking instead of linking the vendor section over there with my signature, I could just link the vendor section here. Maybe help a few people find LOST too.


I would do that. It not only continues to help you, but it also helps LOST in the long run.

:2cents:


:shock:


Last edited by Korny on Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:02 am 
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Well...I just said 270 because I don't plan on operating only for a month, but for years, so it would be the cheapest yearly cost. With the level of exposure I have on JKJ Country now, I might be making 75-100 dollars net a month. I'm very small time, but I've set myself up so that I don't NEED to do more, but CAN do a lot more work. So I can operate indefinitely at these levels or higher levels of production. I can say that I've gone for over a month without a purchase of any kind. The way I'm set up I can do this, less money = less work, which is fine. But with that "business model :-)r " I just can't afford to spend $$$ just to post stuff up on each website. My goal is to get time to finish my website, advertise on LOST, and see where things go.

As for becoming a vendor on this site, I have no idea what it costs to have a "vendor account". I know you're supposed to contact heather if you want to advertise here (banner adds), but I've never seen anything requiring payment to post in the vendors section. I do have a vendor account but have yet to post with it. I was planning on waiting until I got off my butt and finished my website. Personally I did not pay anything for mine, but it does not include advertisement either. An admin gave it to me since I was donating stuff to LOST events, but I haven't done anything with it yet.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:12 am 
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Boiler wrote:
Well...I just said 270 because I don't plan on operating only for a month, but for years, so it would be the cheapest yearly cost. With the level of exposure I have on JKJ Country now, I might be making 75-100 dollars net a month. I'm very small time, but I've set myself up so that I don't NEED to do more, but CAN do a lot more work. So I can operate indefinitely at these levels or higher levels of production. I can say that I've gone for over a month without a purchase of any kind. The way I'm set up I can do this, less money = less work, which is fine. But with that "business model :-)r " I just can't afford to spend $$$ just to post stuff up on each website. My goal is to get time to finish my website, advertise on LOST, and see where things go.

As for becoming a vendor on this site, I have no idea what it costs to have a "vendor account". I know you're supposed to contact heather if you want to advertise here (banner adds), but I've never seen anything requiring payment to post in the vendors section. I do have a vendor account but have yet to post with it. I was planning on waiting until I got off my butt and finished my website. Personally I did not pay anything for mine, but it does not include advertisement either. An admin gave it to me since I was donating stuff to LOST events, but I haven't done anything with it yet.



From your first post, you are making me sound like a money hungry owner here. If I was, the $270 would be per month. You are also thinking my new vendor section will destroy JKJ? It won't. It will help the vendor sell more and users will enjoy having a section to ask questions, rather then on long post. You have to understand, it cost money to run a forum(forum software, server costs, domain, and so on) so I hope you understand how unfair it is that if you are on JKJ for free, selling your products, putting money into your pocket, while using the site for advertising, is unfair to me. I just don't think its right for you or anyone else to get pissed at me for asking you to start paying and the $30/month or $270/yr I am asking is nothing. Do you see where I am coming from now??

Edit: One more thing, I was re-reading your first post a little more. So basically, you are complaining about me charging a vendorship fee that won't work for you because, as you put it, getting off your butt to do a little more work, is something you don't want to do right now. So now I am reading this lovely post about me and how I being the new owner of JeepKJ.com will destroy it, because you don't feel like putting a little more work into your own biz?? Thank you for that! :roll:


Last edited by Korny on Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:40 am, edited 5 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 3:20 am 
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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:54 am 
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A healthy vendor section pays for itself through member retention

So in essence, a free vendor is still providing you with income as well

Less vendors, less chance for retention

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 9:38 am 
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JeepinJarhead03 wrote:
A healthy vendor section pays for itself through member retention

So in essence, a free vendor is still providing you with income as well

Less vendors, less chance for retention


x2.

Oh, and :POPCORN:

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 Post subject: Re: JKJC changes
PostPosted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 10:23 am 
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JeepinJarhead03 wrote:
A healthy vendor section pays for itself through member retention

So in essence, a free vendor is still providing you with income as well

Less vendors, less chance for retention


Thats kind of what I was thinking. Getting more little guys in there would give his audience more options, and hopefully a complete list of possibilities offered for the KJ

To the JKJC owner: I think you're reading a little more into my posts than I intended. I'm not saying your price is too high, just that it is too high for me, and I never said you're going to destroy the site. Simply that I thought that ending the free vendor section would not be beneficial for the site or its members. I never called you greedy or anything negative. I simply was stating that I thought some of the changes being made were not in the best interest of the community. That's it. Let me reiterate in red:

Boiler wrote:
I'd bring this up in that forum, but I didn't feel comfortable doing that. I'm just wishing Bennett would have offered the site to someone already involved with it.
1) Honestly I think the site would continue along the path that most people were there for if an admin / mod bought it and basically kept it the same. I think this would be true with most forums that were in a position to be ran by either an enthusiast or a 2nd party. It was nothing against you or any of your policies, personally.

The new guy obviously bought it as a business and personally I think his ideas to make money are going to diminish the site.
2) I never considered that someone might just "like forums" as a reason to buy one that they weren't a part of. I just assumed it was a business venture, my bad. Please see #5 as to my reasoning that the changes might diminish the site, in my opinion

He came to me asking for $270 a year to be a "preferred vendor". Sounds reasonable, but its more than I can afford for such things. Effectively more than what I'd pay for hosting and domains for my own site. He also told me he won't continue letting non-preferred people post in the vendors alley because it wouldn't be fair to the preferred vendors.
3) I simply stated what you told me and that it was too expensive for me. I think your price to become a preferred vendor is reasonable, as stated, but it is not for me. I am not lazy for not making more business to pay your fee like you insinuate. I have a full time job, 2 young kids, for my business I am the accountant, sales department, management, purchasing department, engineering, fabrication department, service department, and delivery man. It takes a lot of time. I also have another venture that takes about 8 hours a week. I'm working on something 12 hours a day, six or seven seven days a week. Fabrication comes first, shipping second, and expanding the business when I have time :dizzy:

I think it could still be worth being a preferred vendor for some, basically getting your own space to post, where you can mediate your own threads, etc, as opposed to little guys all just posting threads in a big mishmash of other peoples threads. Plus I'm guessing those people would get banner adds, but who knows, that might cost more.
4) In no way was any of that intended as an attack...

He has every right to do what he wants, its his site now. I just think that there will essentially be harder for the community to find available products now, as little guys and oddball type things won't pay to become preferred.
5) Like I quoted at the beginning of the post, less little guys offering their stuff = less options for your members. Was an observation, thats it.

I hope this site gets offered up to a member if they ever sell it off....
6) I was referring to LOST, that if the ownership gets tired of it, I hope they offer it to a member or member group.


I don't think there is anything wrong at all with your new vendor section. I think its great. If it made sense to me financially I would be a part of it and I was planning on being on it down the road. The whole point was the destruction of the vendors alley. Selling through threads in a particular forum section is not exactly putting a banner add at the top of the page. I don't think "free = you can post in this area" vs "paid = you get your own showroom, intro, advertising, and mailing" would work that badly together. If you disagree, no problem. That's just my opinion.

But I'm not attacking you personally. Please accept my apologies for any misunderstanding.

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