2.8L VM Diesel rebuild kit ?

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 12:51 pm

I have a chance to buy a 2005 Jeep Liberty Diesel. I am guessing that the PO did NOT take care of the engine, and it needs to be rebuilt. Is there any rebuild kits out there for this engine ?
I have been searching, and can't seem to come up with anything. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks. :banghead:

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:12 pm

Welcome and if you have not already done so read Sir Sams NOOB guide. As to the engine absent a timing belt failure or a lubrication failure, both of which can cause catastropic engine failure, these engines are pretty solid. That said there are lots of little things that can cause the vehicle to not run well which have nothing to do with the need for an engine rebuild. Depending on your location there may be a forum member in your vicinity to chat with. Other than that how many miles does the vehicle have on it. If near 100,000 or somewhat over the timing belt needs changing if it has not already been done. Over 100,000 without changing the TB is definitly not good but if the belt has not failed or jumped a tooth, see above, all that means is you need to change the TB immediately. Of course flushing incorrect coolant, engine oil, tranny fluid, etc may be needed but none that means and engine rebuild is necessary.

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:14 pm

What exactly is wrong with the engine?

You will find that rebuilding or replacing the engine is an expensive proposition, used engines generally run about 4k.

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:31 pm

Sir Sam wrote:

What exactly is wrong with the engine?

You will find that rebuilding or replacing the engine is an expensive proposition, used engines generally run about 4k.

I am not exactly sure what is wrong with the engine. It is at a REPO lot. We went and looked at it. Had to try about 25 times in order to get it started. When it did start, it smoked like CRAZY for a minute or so. Would not stay running at all if I took my foot of the excellorator. It for sure doesn't sound like it is running on all cylinders. Pushing down on the pedal, it will NOT go over 2,000 RPM.
Not sure whether to bid on it or not. Not sure either where to look for any used engines for it. Body and interior are in excellent condition. Really would like to get a CRD, but so far haven't had any luck getting one in my price range.
Thanks for any advice you might have.

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:36 pm

papaindigo wrote:

Welcome and if you have not already done so read Sir Sams NOOB guide. As to the engine absent a timing belt failure or a lubrication failure, both of which can cause catastropic engine failure, these engines are pretty solid. That said there are lots of little things that can cause the vehicle to not run well which have nothing to do with the need for an engine rebuild. Depending on your location there may be a forum member in your vicinity to chat with. Other than that how many miles does the vehicle have on it. If near 100,000 or somewhat over the timing belt needs changing if it has not already been done. Over 100,000 without changing the TB is definitly not good but if the belt has not failed or jumped a tooth, see above, all that means is you need to change the TB immediately. Of course flushing incorrect coolant, engine oil, tranny fluid, etc may be needed but none that means and engine rebuild is necessary.

We are in Wayland, Michigan. About 10 minutes south of Grand Rapids. The Liberty has 94,000 miles on it. It is at a REPO lot. We went over and looked at it. The exterior, and interior of it are in GREAT shape. When we went to start it, it took about 25 times in order to get it to "catch" and start up. It smoked bad for about a minute, but would not stay running without my foot on the excelorator. For sure it is not firing on all cylinders, and will not go above 2,000 RPM's. Just wondering if it is worth bidding on depending what it will cost to get it on the road.
Thanks for any advice that can be given.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:08 pm

Sir Sam has a lot of experience with timing belt issue but what you describe sounds like it may be a fuel delivery problem such as a clogged fuel filter or air in the fuel filter head. The fixes are a new filter and/or bleeding the air out of the filter head. Try pumping the primer bulb on the filter head if it's really soft & doesn't pump hard quickly there is a lot of air in the system which has to be vented thru the bleed valve on the opposite side of the filter head and if there is enough air in the system it may have gotten into the fuel rail which takes a long time to purge the air. Did the filter head have a bright blue electrical plug on the driver's side, if not it's a 1st gen head and they are very prone to air problems. You might also want to discuss this with Keith at Green Diesel (http://www.greendieselengineering.com/g ... ethod=home) as he knows a ton about these motors and is only 140 miles away from you, wish he was that close to me.

I'll certainly defer to Sir Sam and others but this doesn't sound like a bad engine but getting it running will require some time and $s. If it has a 1st gen fuel head that's an easy DIY project (head with filter and wiring pigtail cost ca. $125). At those miles you might as well figure on the timing belt service soon. Depending on what you replace as part of that service it's $200-700 in parts if you shop around and about $600 or so in labor. If you are careful and mechanically experienced you can DIY, GDE rents the tools, especially if there is an experienced forum member to provide advice. In addition you are probably looking at about $1,000, depending on what you DY, to go thru the drive train and get everything up to snuff (belts, turbo hoses, air filter, oil filter and change, tranny service and filters, maybe brakes, etc) assuming the tires are good.

Best I can do at this distance.

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:42 pm

If it runs at all, even as you describe... Then anything it needs is EASY.

I would buy it if it were me, and with the knowledge base on this forum, we have experienced EVERY possible problem on these and can easily point out solutions to try that would take a dealer "mechanic" thousands of dollars of your money to find.

Keith at Green Diesel Engineering is a great resource for you as well, since you are so close... But he might be on a road trip at the moment. He was planning a 2 week road test starting sometime soon, if not already.

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:20 pm

papaindigo wrote:

Sir Sam has a lot of experience with timing belt issue but what you describe sounds like it may be a fuel delivery problem such as a clogged fuel filter or air in the fuel filter head. The fixes are a new filter and/or bleeding the air out of the filter head. Try pumping the primer bulb on the filter head if it's really soft & doesn't pump hard quickly there is a lot of air in the system which has to be vented thru the bleed valve on the opposite side of the filter head and if there is enough air in the system it may have gotten into the fuel rail which takes a long time to purge the air. Did the filter head have a bright blue electrical plug on the driver's side, if not it's a 1st gen head and they are very prone to air problems. You might also want to discuss this with Keith at Green Diesel (http://www.greendieselengineering.com/g ... ethod=home) as he knows a ton about these motors and is only 140 miles away from you, wish he was that close to me.

I'll certainly defer to Sir Sam and others but this doesn't sound like a bad engine but getting it running will require some time and $s. If it has a 1st gen fuel head that's an easy DIY project (head with filter and wiring pigtail cost ca. $125). At those miles you might as well figure on the timing belt service soon. Depending on what you replace as part of that service it's $200-700 in parts if you shop around and about $600 or so in labor. If you are careful and mechanically experienced you can DIY, GDE rents the tools, especially if there is an experienced forum member to provide advice. In addition you are probably looking at about $1,000, depending on what you DY, to go thru the drive train and get everything up to snuff (belts, turbo hoses, air filter, oil filter and change, tranny service and filters, maybe brakes, etc) assuming the tires are good.

Best I can do at this distance.

Thanks for your reply. I do know Keith at Green Diesel Engineering. He did a GDE tune on my wifes Grand Cherokee Overland, with the Mercedes 3.0L Mercedes Diesel, and what a difference it has made so far. I did e-mail him about what he thinks, but have not gotten an answer as of yet from him. What would you think would be a "good price" not to go over on the bidding when it goes up ? Just wondering what type of money I should bid on the Jeep. I don't mind doing the work to get her back on the road, so that isn't an issue, I just don't know how much it is really worth in this state. I really want to find a Liberty Diesel, and as of yet have not had much luck. I see that they are out there, and some people are asking HUGE prices for them. Not saying that they aren't worth that, because a vehicle is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it. My wife have been driving here Diesel GC now for about a year, and I REALLY want to get a Libby Diesel. I am now driving a Jetta TDI, but my oldest daughter will be driving soon, and she will be getting that to drive.
Thanks again for all your help, and hope to here some more. :BINGO:

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:58 pm

Bidding on it? As in an auction?

Without knowing what the engines needs or what might potentially be wrong with it $2-4k.

Ajamant · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:22 pm

I've been wanting a CRD Cherokee for a long time!!!!! Buy the Libby and bring her back to life. GDE is a great resource and this is hands down the best forum for the diesel.

I'm in the Ann Arbor area if u have any questions.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:23 pm

Air in the fuel?
Try bleeding the air out before you tear the engine apart.
Read up on Lift Pump Upgrades.

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:30 pm

Sir Sam wrote:

Bidding on it? As in an auction?

Without knowing what the engines needs or what might potentially be wrong with it $2-4k.

Thanks Sir Sam.
That is what I am thinking. I won't go above $3,500.00 for it. In the auction yard, they won't let you tare it down at all to see what is going on. They did let us hook up the scanner, and we were able to see several things. EGR valve code of coarse, air in fuel system, #3 cylinder some type of compression issue. Don't really remember much more than that, it was raining out while we were looking at it.
I would really love to get my hands on a Libby Diesel, my wife doesn't let me drive her GC Diesel much.

ckhenshaw4 · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:44 pm

Ajamant wrote:

I've been wanting a CRD Cherokee for a long time!!!!! Buy the Libby and bring her back to life. GDE is a great resource and this is hands down the best forum for the diesel.

I'm in the Ann Arbor area if u have any questions.

Ajamant,
I just sent you a P.M.

geordi · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:32 pm

Tell everyone else about the 'compression' code, it will scare them off.

I strongly suspect that code has to do with the other code, the air-in-fuel which is usually the Large Leak code. All point to one thing - It could use a lift pump, fresh filter, and some time idling to work the air out of the high pressure fuel rail.

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:00 am

Better think twice about that engine, this coming from a guy who just bought one thinking it had a bad engine.

$4000 for an engine(a little on the low side) plus $3500 for a vehicle is getting up there in price, there was one for sale somewhere like tulsa recently that was perfectly drivable, but needed some transfer case shifting linkage or Tcase replacment.

Point being, you may not save much by the time its all done.

That being said, if your ready to learn and tear into it, and replace expensive parts, you might be able to fix it.

For an example, I posted a PSA about timing belt changes and what happens when you don't change the belt:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=62278&hilit=PSA+timing+belt

geordi · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:36 am

Sam, with all your experience with sad CRD engines, what do you think might be going on with this one besides a possible air issue? Is there something else that would cause that #3 code in your knowledgebase?

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:01 pm

geordi wrote:

Sam, with all your experience with sad CRD engines, what do you think might be going on with this one besides a possible air issue? Is there something else that would cause that #3 code in your knowledgebase?

Geordi I really hesitate to speculate on this one. (With no offense to ckhenshaw4) We haven't gotten a full background info......we don't even know the code numbers that were pulled.

Massive air leak....ok maybe, timing off, probably not, bad injector, possible, bad glow plug possible. Basically without knowing more I think its a pretty big crapshoot, so you need to talk into it thinking its the worst(engine) and be happy if its less. Since you cannot count on it being fixable the cost of replacing an engine needs to factor into the equation.

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:29 pm

Air in fuel will create lots of smoke and make it sound like its running on one cylinder if at all.

jinstall · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:30 pm

just FYI a new engine from Chrysler was $3500 but took forever to get here from Italy, like 7 months. they carry a 3yr 100,000 mile warranty. I can give you the part # if you need it.

racertracer · **Posted:** Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:35 pm

Well, why buy a used one for 4000 if you can get new one for 3500, what did it come with Jinstall?

2.8L VM Diesel rebuild kit ?

Who is online