New Diesel Jeep available in the US

Hero · **Joined:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 5:32 pm **Posts:** 122

Taz wrote:

I did a little research on the UK Jeep web site and the CRD is actually cheaper than the 5.7L HEMI. That would put a limited CRD GC at around $40,000.

I'd bite! Well depending on how much the most basic JGC CRD 4x4 package is, if it is less than $30k... consider me sold

RFCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 12:31 am

Hero wrote:

Taz wrote:

I did a little research on the UK Jeep web site and the CRD is actually cheaper than the 5.7L HEMI. That would put a limited CRD GC at around $40,000.

I'd bite! Well depending on how much the most basic JGC CRD 4x4 package is, if it is less than $30k... consider me sold

Don't hold your breath. Read recently where DC is pricing this as the "premium" drivetrain in the US in the same spirit as the big Japaneese hybrids pull a performance premium in the luxury market. Take a swag at it by looking at the HEMI 5.7 + @ $2K at least to cover the extra pricey emissions stuff. My guess is @ $40K. I would even predict that if it doesn't sell in the US at a big premium, it will dissappear as quickly as the Liberty CRD.

KJbob · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:49 am

My guess (hope) is that they will add a crd package to both the Laredo and Limited and charge maybe a $2k premium for the diesel. I'm guessing a reasonably equipped GC CRD will sticker at about $36k.

Liberty CRD's aren't going away because of pricing or weak demand; The current engine can't meet the '07 emmission reg's without extensive and cost prohibitive re-work.

jinstall · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:32 am

You name it in the DC lineup here in Europe and it has a CRD in it, bar just a few. The new Caliber has the CRD.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 1:12 pm

Ranger1 wrote:

We are aware of the European GC's. There is also a European Liberty (Cherokee), but the US launch, with it's engine/emissions PCM software totally re-written for US EPA emissions laws, has suffered from the modifications to meet those requirements. It wouldn't surprise me to eventually find out that the transmission shuddering and eventual failure is related to the egr-engine-transmission computer mapping. This is probably why we in the US cannot use the reputation that the European versions of these vehicles enjoy as an indicator of US reliability. Look at the difference in the Euro and US versions of the Cherokee/Liberty in egr/transmission reliability.

There is very little difference in the PCM programming and that may be the actual problem, remember they are even stricter on all accounts then US except CARB and have what we would call ULSD, with Europe averaging <100 ppm of sulfur and most Western European countries have 30 to 50 ppm fuel and that is the real problem. In the VW diesels the PCM were more aggressivly mapped for performance then US cars as were trans controllers, and same is probably true with the tranny in the Jeep. However the Euro models might possibly have the MB W5A/NAG-1 tranny instead of Dodge 545RLE we have in the US, and that really would make a big difference.

I think we we see a lot of improvement in the Liberty CRD when ULSD arrives with it's 46 Cetane fuel. I think that is why some who have problems with the CRD have no prob;lems when using B100 fuel.

KJMedic · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 1:37 pm

Did anyone notice the price on the Limted CRD in Europe? about 30,000 pounds. What would the exchange rate be? I'm not that smart.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 1:53 pm

KJMedic wrote:

Did anyone notice the price on the Limted CRD in Europe? about 30,000 pounds. What would the exchange rate be? I'm not that smart.

Depending on currency exchange rates it could vary, but about $36,000 US sounds about right if 1 pound = $1.20 is current rate.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:50 pm

oldnavy wrote:

KJMedic wrote:

Did anyone notice the price on the Limted CRD in Europe? about 30,000 pounds. What would the exchange rate be? I'm not that smart.

Depending on currency exchange rates it could vary, but about $36,000 US sounds about right if 1 pound = $1.20 is current rate.

If you're talking the UK, exchange rate on the pound is closer to $1.75. (or @ $52K US for that Limited CRD) And at $7.50/gal for the fuel, the cost difference may be worth it.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:23 pm

RFCRD wrote:

oldnavy wrote:

KJMedic wrote:

Did anyone notice the price on the Limted CRD in Europe? about 30,000 pounds. What would the exchange rate be? I'm not that smart.

Depending on currency exchange rates it could vary, but about $36,000 US sounds about right if 1 pound = $1.20 is current rate.

If you're talking the UK, exchange rate on the pound is closer to $1.75. (or @ $52K US for that Limited CRD) And at $7.50/gal for the fuel, the cost difference may be worth it.

Tell you how much I have paid attention to exchange rates since I have retired, and I didn't take into account about import duties and transportation cost.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:50 am

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

oldnavy wrote:

KJMedic wrote:

Did anyone notice the price on the Limted CRD in Europe? about 30,000 pounds. What would the exchange rate be? I'm not that smart.

Depending on currency exchange rates it could vary, but about $36,000 US sounds about right if 1 pound = $1.20 is current rate.

If you're talking the UK, exchange rate on the pound is closer to $1.75. (or @ $52K US for that Limited CRD) And at $7.50/gal for the fuel, the cost difference may be worth it.

Tell you how much I have paid attention to exchange rates since I have retired, and I didn't take into account about import duties and transportation cost.

Last month while in England I walked by a small Jeep dealer in hopes of getting a look at their CRD emissions hardware. They were closed but had a new Liberty/Cherokee CRD Limited in the window with a big sale tag on it. IIRC the price after exchange rate was slightly over $40K US.

kj lad · **Posted:** Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:06 pm

Yep, Jeeps aren't cheap in the UK!

Ian

Ranger1 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:40 pm **Posts:** 1137

oldnavy wrote:

Ranger1 wrote:

We are aware of the European GC's. There is also a European Liberty (Cherokee), but the US launch, with it's engine/emissions PCM software totally re-written for US EPA emissions laws, has suffered from the modifications to meet those requirements. It wouldn't surprise me to eventually find out that the transmission shuddering and eventual failure is related to the egr-engine-transmission computer mapping. This is probably why we in the US cannot use the reputation that the European versions of these vehicles enjoy as an indicator of US reliability. Look at the difference in the Euro and US versions of the Cherokee/Liberty in egr/transmission reliability.

There is very little difference in the PCM programming and that may be the actual problem, remember they are even stricter on all accounts then US except CARB and have what we would call ULSD, with Europe averaging <100 ppm of sulfur and most Western European countries have 30 to 50 ppm fuel and that is the real problem. In the VW diesels the PCM were more aggressivly mapped for performance then US cars as were trans controllers, and same is probably true with the tranny in the Jeep. However the Euro models might possibly have the MB W5A/NAG-1 tranny instead of Dodge 545RLE we have in the US, and that really would make a big difference.

I think we we see a lot of improvement in the Liberty CRD when ULSD arrives with it's 46 Cetane fuel. I think that is why some who have problems with the CRD have no prob;lems when using B100 fuel.

It was a VP from jeep who stated that the emissions software maps on the US spec CRD were totally rewritten for US EPA emissions requirements. He claimed the Euro software wouldn't pass any US emissions laws. The stricter NOx emissions means the software written for Euro-spec CRD's wouldn't even meet pre 2007 EPA requirments.

The Euro emissions requirements focus on CO2 reduction more so than NOx and are much more relaxed than EPA on NOx emissions. The amount of EGR gas cycling on Euro models is far less than our US spec models. I know in my case, I'm not interested in any future diesels from DCX until they've fixed the oily CAC issue and dumped EGR as an emissions control device - which probably can't happen if/until SCR (Urea injection aka AdBlue) is approved by EPA.

And speaking of oily CAC messes, I was just looking at GreenCarCongress on their Grand Cherokee V6 diesel announcement - there is a picture of the V6 diesel engine - right there on the left cylinder bank is an almost identical OEM ccv valve that our CRD's have. Hard to believe they would use it again. OldNavy, you might want to see if your new ccv can be adapted to the V6 diesel!

RFCRD · **Posted:** Sat Jun 17, 2006 10:49 pm

Ranger1 wrote:

I know in my case, I'm not interested in any future diesels from DCX until they've fixed the oily CAC issue and dumped EGR as an emissions control device - which probably can't happen if/until SCR (Urea injection aka AdBlue) is approved by EPA.

I can second that. Just be glad to have learned the oily CAC lesson on the $25K vehicle and not the $40K vehicle. Read recently that the next generation VW TDI uses a more advanced catalyst (req ULSD), particulate trap, and some fine tuning to eliminate the need for an EGR. Just never could understand the logic behind adding a device like and EGR that decreases combustion efficiency, then expect lower emissions. You can see by the extra soot that something is wrong with that equation.

New Diesel Jeep available in the US

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